Breeding Timing

[Symbro]

I have several pairs of pigeons that i have been allowing to bond. Other than three who seem to either be missexed or too young, they have successfully bonded. Each pair has been in its individual boxes which are locked at this time.

Now this week i need to seperate them. they will be seperated for three weeks. this is so that they lay all thier eggs within the same time. I have three choices in which i can do this.

A) Lock the Cocks in the breeding boxes and allow the hens to run free in the breeding loft.

B) Lock the hens in the breeding boxes and allow the cocks to run free in the breeding loft
(i dont see this happening since the cocks are rather aggressive, expecially one, and there would be no hidding places if they were loose)

C) Throw the cocks into the Flying loft and allow the hens to run free in the breeding loft with the nesting boxes open.

to me C sounds the best since that would allow everyone some free run and allow the hens to make thier nests while they wait.

This is the first year i am breeding. and all these birds are yearlings. Also i have seen at least one pair "Jump" a few times. so i know the hen should be laying eggs soon.

Symbro

[re lee]

With the 2006 season so close. I would hold until say last week of nov. To put them back together. And agin lock them in the holes. To assure pairing. Cocks I would leave them in the breeding side of the loft and move the hens. You can not get them to balance on laying times. As some go down faster then others. BUT last week of nov. Will gett them down on eggs and you can have youngbirds ready to band for the 06 season right at the turn of the year. This would be a great time 1 week prior to the season to give your hens 1 oyster shel tab a day for 5 days. The day you put the birds back together. You can give the cocks 1 200 unit vit, E cap for 4 days. Seem it gets to kick in the breeding season very well. And aids on early fertile on eggs. So you have less first round clear eggs. Might give it a try. Ive done well through the years on this method.

[Symbro]

re lee
so you are suggesting keeping the cocks locked up in the breeding pens and letting the hens fly free in the breeding loft?

soon i will be increasing the light cycle. this should start producing the hormones for breeding... the only problem is that my breeding pens are new to me and i dont know if they can "jump" in there. if i have to i will spend a couple of days openning the pens one at a time and allow them to "play" on the ground. the one pair that i have seen "jump"ing only do it when i let them out.

we are trying to get one good round in the YB loft this year and stop there. everything hinges around jan 1st (this is the first year i am breeding any) Last year we lost alot of birds due to being too old when moved over (strong on the wing) to the YB loft or being late hatches and not properly trained. this year i am taking a part in the trainning and breeding. hopefully we can cut are losses back considerably and get them trained and moulted properly.

we even bought Hawkeye to help with breeding pairs and the such. it is a rather good program. sorry i am rambling

Symbro

*edit*
to answer the question you had on the other thread. we are planning on about 60-70 birds. he has a few proven pairs. but all of mine are a mixture of birds i have recieved from other people. unfortunately his records in the last few years sucked. it is the best word i could use to discribe the state of breeding and housing. it will almost be like starting out fresh. but we have done alot of work in the last few months and i am really excited to see what happens in 2006.

[re lee]

I was thinking you had a divider loft where you could put the hens away from the breeder loft. Let the cocks loose in the breeder side. they can go in and out of there holes. . when you wean the youngbirds say at 28 or 35 days which you decide. I would move them to the youngbird side. Let them find the feed and water the first day. And start trap training them the second day. Then they are ready to sit the loft. They are still not wingstrong. So they sit mostly the first few days. And then start short loops. After the first 8 to 10 days juymp them up if need be they will make a few short loops and back to the loft. During this early time. You work on calling them in with feeding routine. If you let all the youngbirds mature befor tossing. Its much easyer to train them out. As they are all being trained out at the same time. So loft traing exersise. Up to say for week befor race season is good enough then down the road. At that time you have birds that are from 7 to 4 months in age. depends on rounds . Then you can start say the 5 mile then a ten jump to a 20 then a 35 then the 50. 50 mile toss is really all you need to get them ready for the races. some train to the first release point. BUT I think thats a waste. 1 five 2 tens one 20 2 35 and 2 fiftys your birds are ready. The last fifty should be 1 week befor the first race. conditoned around the loft. puts them in shape. I myself will start out at a 20 or 25 as the birds have routed out well for awhile if they are loft trained proper. And a 20 or 25 They have propably been out there just flying. But many like the short tosses at first . Thinking they will not loose any at first. SMART birds fly smart. And best thing is to build 2 youngbird teams. So as you do not over work your youngbirds throught the season. As many clubs fly and drop back during the season You can rest out the different teams. and 60 to 70 youngbirds deduct for just a few training lost birds. You should have a strong youngbird team of birds. NOW remember I think its good to follow the sun reports on elcrto magnetic stormdays. As this creates lost bird races. and slow days. Do not send out a whole team on the high days. You might find they fall prey to mistrack and end up off course. And now days. more and more solar problems give way to lost numbers. So agin every day loft traing brings stronger homing to the loft as they find that field Which some think now is spesific gravity to the loft region. But who nows for sure it does though make a certion sence. Any way good luck in the up com,ing 06 season

[WhiteWingsCa]

As re lee has said -- keep the cocks in the breeding boxes. Leave the nest box fronts open -- then the cocks can sort out who's top man on the totem pole - and have already finished their territory fighting before you move the hens back in. Keep track of which cock bird is sleeping in which nest box at night.

When you put the hens in -- lock the cock birds in the nest boxes. This is where it's important that you've been watching which bird has staked out which box as his own.

Then, put the hen in with the cock bird - just a couple at a time, so you can watch for the cock birds getting too aggressive with the hen. When it looks like a couple of pairs are going to settle in - put a couple more hens over.

It is important to make sure you have the cock birds in the proper nest ("Claimed" one) box -- otherwise, once the pairs have all laid their eggs, and you let them out to free fly in the breeding pen - there will be fighting in the nest boxes, resulting in broken nests/eggs, or killed babies.

Unless you have HUGE nest boxes, you don't want to keep the pairs locked in for the entire breeding/raising period - they need to get out and stretch, fly around the loft, get out in the aviary, etc. And get away from the youngsters for a break, once they are a bit older.

Remember too - if you're breeding really early in the year - you have to be able to let the youngsters out to fly by 5 weeks of age - 6 weeks at the most, or you'll possibly experience high losses. If you're in a warm climate, that's not a problem - but if you're in snow country, it could be.

Also - you mention separating them for 3 weeks -- then putting them together. This means they could lay by mid-December -- so you're babies will hatch first week of January. Will you have bands for 06 by then? Don't get caught putting them together too soon - or you could end up with babies and no bands..... An established pair can (and will) lay within 10 days once put together - we've had them lay as early as 7 days, for a pair that's been together for a long time.

[Symbro]

yep yep done all that. and i have nest boxes are big enough to leave them in. and we are wanting them to be banded as close to the 1st as possible. and not be needed to be banded before that.

All the cocks have already staked out thier breeding pens. i have been keeping them all locked up to bond and occationally let them out. that is when all the fun happens. however they have already claimed thier boxes. it is just a matter of having to seperate them so they dont breed too soon.

Symbro

Ps i think i have decided to lock the cocks in the breeding pens and free fly the hens in the breeding loft. the cocks will all be able to see thier hens though.

[lawman]

Hi Symbro,

you've already been given plenty of good advice as to pairing times and keeping the birds separate until then. So, I'll only ask one thing, have your breeders been immunized at all.

hopefully this has already been done for PMV and Paratyphoid? If not and you want to make sure your breeders are fit and ready to go? it may mean holding off putting the birds together a little longer and perhaps getting late jan or early feb hatchs.

I understand the desire to get early hatchs but it may all be for naught if the parents get sick.

[Symbro]

the person i am flying with has helped me with all my medications. personally i need to learn more about what and when. but he has made sure my pigeons are healthy in that respect.

[birdboy12]

Well since we are in the breeding subject I want to bring something up.I have all my paired birds in the breeding loft and all my other birds that are not paired up in another loft.I have the nest boxes set up with the nest bowls and I have pine needles out.I have the widowhood nest boxes and took up the fronts so they are opened up.The thing is they dont go into the boxes or breed.This is the first year they have done this.Im thinking about doing 1 of 2 things.1:Split the pairs up for about two weeks then put them all back into the breeding loft so they have more of a drive to breed.2:Get rid of all my birds and go to a flyer around my house and buy proven pairs.So should I split them up for awhile to get more drive into them.I know for a fact them im going to get rid of the birds that arent paired up and that wont pair up.So hopfuly the birds will start to breed and then I can put the young birds in the race loft and use the old birds as breeders.Another thing is that alot of these birds that im trying to get to breed I had them in the flying loft and flew them.Could that have anything to do with the reason why they dont want to breed.

[re lee]

First are you sure you have pairs. second its a little early to put the birds together. As the 06 season is so close. I would seperated them wait at least until the day after thankgiving then lock them in for pairing. That way when they do lay. they will be able to be 06 youngbirds. So if you do fly them they can make the youngbird season. Getting rid of them you still have to put other birds together anyway. Do you have someone near that might assist you in putting the birds together.

[birdboy12]

Ok when I do seperate them and then put them back together will they mate up with their old mates.Or will they find new ones?I will be contacting a couple of people that might be able to help me pair up birds since I have a hard time telling a cock from a hen.Most of my hens act the same as the cock,as big as the cock,fight like the cock, even though I know she is a hen.I will start splitting the hens from the cocks tomorrow.Im going to leave the cocks in the breeding loft so the can pick out the nest box they want when they get mated back up.