!Found a hurt squab, help ASAP!

[Jaye]

10.4 ounces ? He's a BIG boy. Just keep an eye on the crop, make sure it empties during the night. We don't wanna see crop stasis at this point. Do check on him during the night of you can. If there are any signs of distress, come back here for help.

Also...if you feel he is over 2 weeks old, you can feed defrosted peas and corn as well. He doesn't really have to be on formula anymore.

If you cannot find a 1cc syringe...then perhaps you can do a measurement of the eyedropper volume using one of your bigger measuring devices (i.e. - how many full eyedroppers does it take to get to 5ml/10ml/whatever).

[Dobato]

Originally Posted by iRainy222

Oh my gosh, thank you so much!
Right now he is 10.4 oz, which is 291g. Would it still be okay to do the 50mg/kg BID dosage? Or should it be upped a little?

We have tons of eye dropper's, but I'll see if I can't pick up a proper 1cc syringe by tomorrow. Everything I have here in the house is large for our horses!
I'll see if I can't get some clear images of that leg up here too.

Yes, you will up it a touch, by 1 drop to 0.30cc, or 6 drops, every 12h. After you take the photos of the leg, you can apply a light coating of Neosporin to any open wounds for now.

Karyn

[iRainy222]

So we just woke up, and his crop is empty and he is very bright, hungry, and alert! I also found a 1cc syringe in our first aide kit last night, so he'll start his med's at about 6pm. I gave him the last dose yesterday around 5, so he'll have over 24 hours before we put him on the properly measured amount.
I don't have any frozen peas or corn yet, so he'll have to do with a little bit of applesauce and the formula I made just one last time.
I'll see if he isn't sleepy enough to let me get some pictures of his leg after feeding!

[Dobato]

For feeding here are two links that show essentially the same thing, a person feeding food to a pigeon by hand. In the first link below it will be piece by piece:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uU1SO0ZJoow

In this link it shows the feeding of a seed mixture to a squab a bit younger that the one you have. The seeds are presoaked, meaning you will place the mixed seeds into very warm water for 1/2 hour before feeding, this will help make it easier for him to digest the seeds and also hydrate them, as they would be if the parent was feeding him. You can use wild bird seed mix, just make sure it has no large seeds/corn/peas/peanuts/sunflower seeds in the shell. The video shows well about the right size of the seeds in the mixture could be. Also, if not wild bird seed is around, you can use a budgie seed mix, the seeds will be smaller, but will do fine, they would be soaked the same of course.

Pay attention to how full the crop is in the video, you want your little guy's crop to fill up like this (the crop id a food storage "bag" at the base of the neck area). At the end of the video the person gives the baby some water from his mouth, people around the world do this, but we don't recommend it as a human's mouth has different bacteria that best not be given to a pigeon. You little guy may be old enough to drink on his own, if you dip his beak into a small dish of tepid (slightly warm) water. If not you can dribble water to the side of his beak, but tilt his head slightly down, you have to get 5-7mL of water into him at each feeding to help digest the seeds and to keep him hydrated. If you can't get him drinking on his own keep trying wherever it is time for water for his, do this first, before dribbling. In a week or so he should be ready to start to peck and eat his own food, and by then he should be drinking on his own.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b5H5duyufNk&NR=1

I will post instruction on how to wean him later, here is a link with a few more words on getting them to drink:

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showpo...5&postcount=11

Good luck with him and if you have any questions, just ask.

Karyn

[Msfreebird]

Originally Posted by iRainy222

So we just woke up, and his crop is empty and he is very bright, hungry, and alert! I also found a 1cc syringe in our first aide kit last night, so he'll start his med's at about 6pm. I gave him the last dose yesterday around 5, so he'll have over 24 hours before we put him on the properly measured amount.
I don't have any frozen peas or corn yet, so he'll have to do with a little bit of applesauce and the formula I made just one last time.
I'll see if he isn't sleepy enough to let me get some pictures of his leg after feeding!

Hi iRainy and welcome to PT. Just following this thread.....your in great hands!
Can't wait to see pictures of the little one
And thank you for caring!

[iRainy222]

Here he is from last night! This was our third day having him.

[Jaye]

I am gonna tell you, Rainy...each time I came back to this thread I kept bracing myself for bad news.

Your pal is a little fighter, there. How he/she managed to survive is really impressive. Kudos to you for taking the big decision to start her/him on the antibiotic....because had you waited another half-day, it would have been too late.

Even with that...after 3 days....it was hecka late to start antibiotic on a cat-attacked baby. They usually need the meds w/i the first 2-2.5 days or the infection will have engulfed them beyond a point of return.....

Keep it up....your buddy has a very strong will to live and you have been doing a phenomenal job !

[iRainy222]

Hmm, I can't get the other images to work!
And thank you Jaye, he definitely seems to want to live! His will is very very strong

[Jaye]

He's young...maybe 2 weeks old or so. Cute !

Actually, I might not quite go with veggie-popping yet. I'd stick to a wet formula for a few more days, I think. Can you get baby bird formula ? If not, it can be made from scratch.

Do you think your friend's scale was accurate ? Because I have seen adult Ferals weighing in at about 300-325g. From the looks of the photo, I cannot imagine this baby weighs close to that.

[Ede-bird]

Just want to say WELL DONE!!! To everyone who gathered in to help Rainy and the squeaker - you are the best. Rainy you are going to be an awesome Vet, because you care about ALL creatures, and your instincts for treatment are sound

[Dobato]

Originally Posted by iRainy222

Hmm, I can't get the other images to work!
And thank you Jaye, he definitely seems to want to live! His will is very very strong

Any uploaded images to this site must be below 100kb in size, that may be your problem. You can use Microsoft Paint, a free program that comes with Windows, to resize. Open Paint > Open image> On Menu Bar Go to Image> In Image Drop Down Select, Resize/Skew> Horizontal and Vertical will be at 100%, change to 50% and do save as. Try uploading image to PT, if you find the image a little small, you can delete the image, then go back, open the original Image and instead of 50%, try 75%, and do save as again, upload Image to PT.

Karyn

[iRainy222]

Alrighty! I have my camera charging so I can get some better ones, but for now I'll just see if I can give you the photobucket URL links to them. Again, these were taken rather quickly on my phone camera, so the quality is rather poor.

http://s115.photobucket.com/albums/n...3610517843.jpg
His poor joint is SO inflamed! The flash made how red it is hard to see, but it's extremely red, swollen and hot. There are no lacerations or punctures.

http://s115.photobucket.com/albums/n...3610526230.jpg
Just showing again how red and swollen it is. I wish the images could be larger! I'll have to dig out my nikon camera and get some clearer ones.

http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n...3610494669.jpg
You can see how much smaller his right leg is! Poor thing can't even stand up, he either has to lay down or flop around.

I'm really concerned about how he cannot walk. I don't want the poor baby to be permanently crippled!

And he already associates me with good things, there is no fear in him! He sees my hand and immediately begins to happily peep (he's trying to coo now too, it's so cute!) and will stroke my fingers with his beak, looking for food.

[Dobato]

It may take a few days for the antibiotics to start exert their effect on the leg, so we we will give it a bit more time before making any changes or additions in terms of medication. When they are hurt like this it will take a bit of time until they are mobile, plus he is at an age where he really has not learned to get around too well on his own yet.

See if you can get this little one set up in a donut, like in the link, when they get to realize it a pretty comfortable set up, the sometimes will stay put, you can place a water and seed dish within easy beak reach in case he want to drink or try pecking at some seeds.

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showpo...22&postcount=6

Yes, the phone camera shots are not the best, will wait for closer, more detailed shots.

Karyn

[iRainy222]

I'll make him a 'donut' right after I post this! I tried giving him warm and soaked seeds earlier, but he wanted nothing to do with it. He also didn't want to eat his peas, but I made him eat about 20 because his crop was empty and he needed something in there with his meds.

He was all full and sleepy after, so it was easy to get a few good shots even though I was by myself. I also took him with me to see the family for easter since we'd be gone all day, and he was so well behaved! He is the calmest little fellow, though he wasn't too keen on the little kids getting too close.

Anyhow, these pictures are much better! Do you think it's just from the infection? I've been putting a cold wrap on it for 20 minutes every time I feed, and he seems to like it, though it hasn't done much to decrease the swelling.
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n...n/DSCN1390.jpg
Not the best pic, though you can see his adorable little face!

http://s115.photobucket.com/albums/n...t=DSCN1391.jpg
Probably the best image, you can see how red and swollen it is!

http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n...n/DSCN1392.jpg
Just another from a different angle.

http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n...n/DSCN1393.jpg
You can really see how swollen and red it is here. Poor baby!

http://s115.photobucket.com/albums/n...t=DSCN1394.jpg
The color was a bit washed out from the flash, but you can just see the normal joint on the other side and how large the infected one is comparatively.

I've also been putting a warm, water soaked paper towel on his back puncture for 20 minutes as well, to help draw out the puss. It's still very smelly, but it seems to be draining.
Would be okay to use a bit of Epsom Salt too? We always used that on our horse's hooves when they'd abscess, but I don't know how he'd react to it. If the warm water would be enough, I don't want to hurt him by over doing it!


Thank you all again for your kind words and help! He wouldn't be alive right now if it were for you all.

[Dobato]

You can try the Epsom Salt (Magnesium Sulfate) as it very well may sooth things a bit, but pigeons, and other birds, lack a certain enzyme that liquefies pus (spent leukocytes) so their pus is kind of thick and caseous looking, so does not really flow.

Photos are much better, what I am going to do is have Pidgey, who is very good at wounds/trauma (among other things) have a look at the photos for his opinion, as I want to make sure the is not an possible injury here, outside of infection concerns. So, get this little gut set up in a donut, have him on his meds, try again with the soaked seeds, you can pinch open his mouth with one hand and "pop" pinches of seeds with the other, and make sure he stays well hydrated.

Karyn