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#31
24th July 2007, 05:13 PM
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Hi Margarret,
I would be glad to go over 'Tube Feeding' any time you like. I am comfortable with it, and my methods are completely pedantic and deliberate every time...almost like a Pilot's "Check List" before take off. I have come to favor particular apparatis, even as others have with theirs. It is a very valuable thing to be able to do, and truely, when done nicely, is no strain to the Pigeon at all. There have been many Pigeons pass through here who it would have been much harder to save without it... How I ever managed before learning to do it, I have no idea..! But somehow I did manage, and muddled...and somehow they abided... Phil Las Vegas 
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#32
24th July 2007, 09:28 PM
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Phil,
Thank you for your offer. I'll take you up on it the next time I have a situation that needs it. Terry did show me how she does it and it looked fairly simple at the time. Then when I went to try it later on, I stalled out. Fortunately the bird was willing to eat from the syringe with the vet tape over the end. But I know the time will come when I will need the tube technique. With my luck I'll get a dehydrated half comatose crow who will want to take my arm off rather than have me put a tube down it's throat. LOL! M.
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#33
24th July 2007, 09:40 PM
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Get some Cotton 'people-baby-stockings' tiny ones, and cut a slit at the right place in the 'heel', for the Beak to poke out of, cut off whatever extra length there may be for it to fit right...so the rest covers their Head...
That takes some of the fight and wiggleys out of them, when they can not see anything... 'Some' anyway... Lol... Phil Las Vegas
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#34
25th July 2007, 02:15 AM
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Hi Margarret,
I have a video of tube feeding on youtube. Les said he watched two or three times and was able to use the technique successfully. I think that tubing a bird and tubing a human are very different things , because with birds you feed into the crop rather than the stomach. The young ones swallow the tube eagerly once tey know that it provides food. I have innoculated against PMV after being taught by Helen but that is one of the things that I hate having to do. Cynthia
__________________
 Life is as dear to the mute creature as it is to man. Just as one wants happiness and fears pain, just as one wants to live and not to die, so do other creatures.His holiness the Dalai Lama
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#35
25th July 2007, 02:35 AM
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Quote:
Sick, injured or starved birds are assumed to have at least a 5% deficit. If the skin apppears to be tight, specially over the breastbone and it tents for a while when you pinch it, th eyes look dead and the mouth is dry, then the deficit is between 5% and 10%. If the mouth is very dry, feet and wing tips are cold, you pinch the skin and it stays pinched,the heartbeat is rapid the bird is still, listlesss and depressed then it is near death with a deficit of 10% - 15%. You weigh the bird. Say it weighs 300 gms and you assume dehydration of 5% of its body weight. Assume that before dehydration it weighed 310 gms. The fluid deficit is 5% of 310 , which is 15.5 mls. That is what you have to replace over 3 days (8 ml the first day, 4 ml the second and 3.5 ml the third) But on top of that each day you also have to give it the fluids that it needs for maintenance, ie the amount of fluid that pigeon of that weight would normally drink in a day if it was healthy. Remember that fluids must be warmed to 39 degrees centigrade before they are administered. The higher above 5% that you suspect the deficit is the more urgent veterinary help is so that the right fluids can be administered IV, subQ or intraoseeously. Cynthia
__________________
Life is as dear to the mute creature as it is to man. Just as one wants happiness and fears pain, just as one wants to live and not to die, so do other creatures.His holiness the Dalai Lama Last edited by Feefo; 25th July 2007 at 02:41 AM.
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#36
25th July 2007, 06:51 AM
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Cynthia, thank you for the explanation. It was easy to understand.
Margarret - here is another who does not tube feed even though we have all the equipment needed. Instead, we use a regular 5 cc or 10 cc syringe, depending on the age of the pigeon, and attach a Catac nipple to it. The nipple itself is about 1 1/2 inches long and goes down the throat far enough. We've been using these about 14 years and have had only one mishap when we squirted the nipple into the crop.  That was early on in our "birding" and the rehabber who trained us was able to work it up from the crop into the throat and pull it out. Now, we super glue every nipple to the syringe. They can be used for several weeks because we sterilize them after each feeding and each bird has their own nipple and syringe.
__________________
Maggie
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#37
25th July 2007, 01:37 PM
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Hi Cynthia,
Thank you for those details...excellent... Too, here, in the Southern Mojave Desert, especially in Summer, sick or wayward Birds can dehydrate much more rapidly than in cool and humid climes. People certainly do! It is very common for people to be stumbleing around, almost fainting, and complaining of feeling stunned and diminished. If one works out of doors as I used to, you have to drink literally a Gallon and a half or Two Gallons of Liquids a day, or you will start to feel woosey and dopey and off kilter...and even then, even drinking two Gallons paced through out the day, you might only pee a couple of Tea Cups worth finally at night... Lol... 112, 118, 124 degrees F, or more even some areas ( was 128 outside of Town again a couple weeks ago) , at 4 or 5 percent ambient humidity, takes a lot of Water to stay on top of. Phil Las Vegas
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#38
29th July 2007, 06:45 PM
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One advantage of using the electrolyte powders from the health food store is that the beleagered rehabber can drink the leftovers to improve their own health and immune system.
__________________
Terri B
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#39
29th July 2007, 07:31 PM
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Quote:
Hi TerriB, Yes, and the ones I got are very nice flavored, too. I bought the 32 count box, where usually in the past I'd buy three or four packets merely... Phil Las Vegas
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#40
29th July 2007, 10:08 PM
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Cynthia and Maggie,
Thanks for the info on tube feeding and the nipple variation. Cynthia, I tried to find the Boots tape here, but they don't stock that item although they do carry some Boots products. Double darn! So I'm back to square one on finding something that will stick to itself well enough to hold when I press it together in the middle. Talking about splay leg treatment here. Sorry all, it is way off the topic of rehydration. Margarret
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#41
30th July 2007, 12:21 AM
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Hi Margarret,
I can send some. Cynthia
__________________
Life is as dear to the mute creature as it is to man. Just as one wants happiness and fears pain, just as one wants to live and not to die, so do other creatures.His holiness the Dalai Lama
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#42
30th July 2007, 01:22 AM
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Quote:
'Micropore' Tape, in 1/2 inch or wider widths, may be had of any mini-mall Medical supply...sticks well to Feathers and comes off very well so long as one pull gently in the same direction the Feathers grow...sticks to itself VERY well...is inexpensive...usually 99 Cents a roll... Thats what I use for everything... Phil Las Vegas
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#43
30th July 2007, 05:37 AM
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Micropore is too thin for taping splayed legs, although I suppose you could pad the legs and the space between them then wrap micropore round it all....
Cynthia
__________________
Life is as dear to the mute creature as it is to man. Just as one wants happiness and fears pain, just as one wants to live and not to die, so do other creatures.His holiness the Dalai Lama
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#44
30th July 2007, 08:23 AM
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Cynthia,
That is much too generous of you to offer to send some all the way over here. Let me try fooling with the mircopore (thanks Phil) and see if I can make that work before your going to the trouble of mailing tape to me. I will see if I can devise some padding beneath it where it goes around the leg and then pinch it together in the middle as your picture shows. Margarret
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#45
30th July 2007, 08:34 AM
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Cynthia, really excellent information, thanks for taking the time.
This is a really important topic. fp
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| Tags |
| international rehydration solution, rehydrating solution, splayed leg, tube feeding |
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