Saved baby....need tips on release

[Jaye]

Hi Everyone. I am a new member here. I have a specific situation I could use some advice on. I have perused the archives and threads similar in nature, as well as sending e-mails to some members who seemed particularly knowledgable about how to release.

The info I have read is good, but I have some specific questions particularly in regards to the current state the situation here. This is gonna be a bit long, so bear with me:

....I have had pigeons living and nesting in the lightwell of my apt. bldg. since 1999....right outside my kitchen window. We have been
pals ever since. The families keep changing, and some veterans stayed put for years and years and I have seen many generations of their kids.

11 days ago, I looked out there and found a mangled corpse of a baby pigeon...one of two which had recently hatched. I figured it was taken by a redtail hawk, of which there are a few since I live near a park. But, it must have been one hecka ballsy hawk to descend 2 storeys into a 12x15 lightwell.

Two days later...I found another nestling which was at the ground floor of the lightwell...torn to shreds. With the help of some folks ant NYC Rescue, we determined that it wasn't a hawk which had done this, but a rat.

(UPDATE: if you read my other thread in 'feral pigeon' section...we were wrong...it was a small hawk...it actually returned and killed an adult.....)

I went out and took in the surviving nestling outside my kitchen window. He/she was between 15 and 20 days old when I brought him in (link to pic below).

With the help of my local avian vet (I have 3 parrots), they gave her a once-over to check her health....and then showed me how to syringe-feed it.

He's been with me for a 10 DAYS now and is eating pretty well and growing and strong. Also pecking at seed very voraciously. He is also a cutie...very full of personality...and pushy !!!

Meanwhile, I am trying to take care of the rat problem.

So, the great news is: the lil' guy has been saved from the rat, and I have been able to handfeed it and sustain it's health as she grows.

I put it's cage outside on my porch and in the lightwell a little bit each day, since that is where the wild pigeons hang out, roost, and forage occasionally. I let him out for a few minutes as the adult pigeons eat some seed I give to them. Sometimes he just stays close to his box, and sometimes he dives into the group of adults and begs...at which point, they usually scuttle away, or one occassionally chases him away from the seed. As I said, he is beginning to peck at the seed and consume some.

The parents show up in the lightwell ocassionally, and they can hear it crying....but they have come less frequently since I have taken it in....(2 times, brief visits, in past 3-1/2 days)....and they no longer seem to roost here at night.

So, she has been observing adults close up, and there are a few pairs of regular visitors still coming here..so there are about 6-8 pigeons around regularly, two being her parents.

....NOW WHAT ????? I love birds and although I have a bunch of wild pigeon friends all around our building... I would prefer that this lil' one join them, and not become my companion.

I have several quetsions on how I should do this.

1) She's about 4 weeks old right now...give or take a day or two. Flapping strongly, hopping and occasionally gets airborne for a few seconds, albeit only a foot off the ground. Within a week, I would suspect it will be able to fully fly. So I am assuming I can safely take her outside to watch other pigeons forage, without fear that she could actually fly away from me. IS THIS CORRECT ? OR AM I TAKING A CHANCE I COULD LOSE HER ?

2) I am still handfeeding her 2x/day. I syringe in about 13-16 cc of Kaytee formula a day, and she eats about 2 teaspoons of seed a day. AT WHAT POINT SHOULD I CUTBACK THE HANDFEEDING TO 1X/DAY, IN ORDER TO START WEENING ? AT WHAT POINT SHOULD I CUT OUT HANDFEEDING ALTOGETHER ?

A recap: this baby spend the first 2+ weeks of her life in her nest, being tended to by mom & dad. I have had her for only the past 10 days. I would like to segue her back into the wild, WHEN SHE'S READY, but do not want to risk her flying off prematurely or flying to a location where I cannot retrieve her.....
I feel fortunate that there are some pigeons regularly around the house, so am hoping they can serve as examples to her.

Suggestions appreciated.

here's a link to a pic of him the day before I took him in....

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e213/jaye86/pigie.jpg

[Charis]

What a Cutie and a great rescue.
Four weeks is way too young to let Cutie go. As you have been doing sounds great...spending time with the ferals and always a safe home to return to. If you continue in the same way, I suspect the bird will separate from you and the safety of your home when the bird is ready to. I think it's a perfect arrangement.
As far as hand feeding, they have always let me know when they don't wish to be hand fed any longer. That's usually when I think they will NEVER be totally self feeding and I'll still be mixing that formula when they have gray feathers.

[Charis]

This might be helpful as well
.http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showthread.php?t=10874

[Lady Tarheel]

Welcome to the forum. I love stories like yours and believe me, you have the best of circumstances to release your baby when the time is right.

You want her to be fully feathered, eating totally on her own, flying well and her feathers need to be conditioned so she sheds water before being released.

Always check under their wings to make sure all the feathers are in and that wing and tail feathers have grown to a good length.

I would begin feeding her only in the evening but making sure seed and water is always available. You can stop that feeding probably in a week or so, just as long as she is eating well on her own. We like to weigh them to make sure they're not losing weight.

Also, when they learn to fly it is usually when they begin "dancing" around on a kitchen counter or the floor. They flap their little wings and hop around. I wouldn't put her freely with the adult pigeons just yet. You can set her in her cage in the area where they feed and let her become familiar with them and watch them eat. If you allow her to freely mingle with them right now, she may get "spooked" and take off. I have seen them do it when I didn't think they could fly.

Give her baths about every other day so her feathers can become water-proof.

It won't take much longer - maybe three more weeks or a bit longer. You are so lucky that you will be able to keep an eye on her. Releasing ours is always the hardest part of rehabbing.

[Jaye]

Hi. She is just beginning to dance around on the counter or the floor....she has just started hopping up in and out of her box on her own, and begun to perch on the edge of her box regularly. Is beginning to flap vigorously.

Amazing design, these guys. As I said, I have a lot of experience with parrots...but the anatomy of columbids is very different...their proportions are different. They are all wing.

So you think that just viewing the adults from inside is good enough for now ? She does get a bit spooked by them sometimes, but then she also just barges right into the middle of 'em other times (wants to be fed by an adult, I suspect). However, there have been times when the adults took off in a flutter and she basically flapped, but stayed grounded. My heart jumps up to my throat the couple of times that has happened...but I am trying not to be a nervous nellie.....

Thanks for the info on the feeding, too. Unfortunately, I don't have a gram scale. Does the 15 cc of formula plus 2 tsp. seed sound like an adequate daily intake for a 4-week old ????

Also, regarding water...how should I serve it up ? Bowl ? saucer ? Bottle cap? Thimble ? (no, just kidding). I have been also giving him about 1 cc of Pedialyte daily as well, for extra hydration although I suspect the wetness of the formula is sufficient.

He/she isn't chubby....but most of the other wild fledglings I have seen over the years start out being on the lithe side at this stage.

Thanks for the replies so far.....please keep them coming....I need all the help I can get

[Lady Tarheel]

Jaye, she is a cutie. She is probably at my favorite age in their "growing up" process. You mentioned that the adult pigeons do get spooked at times and she would flap. That is the danger. If she senses danger when they do, and if she can fly, she will take flight with them and may not come back. If she has a cage you can set her out with the adults and let her watch them but otherwise I wouldn't until she meets all the criteria I suggested in the other post. You also need to be there with her any time she is outside, even in a cage, because of the rat problem.

I think, if she is eating on her own that the 15 cc of Kaytee, plus the 2 tsp of seed is enough for another week or so. She looks very healthy and bright-eyed. Her tail feathers still seem pretty short and I didn't see any true flight feathers on her wings - have they been clipped at all?

[TheSnipes]

Originally Posted by Jaye

[color="DarkRed"][font="Trebuchet MS"]
Also, regarding water...how should I serve it up ? Bowl ? saucer ? Bottle cap? Thimble ? (no, just kidding).

Give her water in a dish deep enough so she can siphon up the liquid. They need at least an inch or so to get their beak in far enough to do that, so a couple inches of water makes sure she can get a sip whenever she wants one.

[Jaye]

Thanks for the watering tip, Snipes.

Lady...no, she definitely has not been clipped. His/her primary wing feathers are definitely in...and you are correct, tail feathers still quite short.

At first I didn't understand what you were saying.

It seemed to me that the SAFEST time to let her "practice forage" with the adults is when she cannot get airborne, as opposed to letting her practice when that possibility exists.

I slept on that, and am thinking that...what you are saying is: it's better to let her practice forage with the adults when she is at an age where, if she does take off with them, she has a better chance of survival.

Do I have that right ? Or am I still off.....???

[Lady Tarheel]

Originally Posted by Jaye

Thanks for the watering tip, Snipes.

Lady...no, she definitely has not been clipped. His/her primary wing feathers are definitely in...and you are correct, tail feathers still quite short.

At first I didn't understand what you were saying.

It seemed to me that the SAFEST time to let her "practice forage" with the adults is when she cannot get airborne, as opposed to letting her practice when that possibility exists.

I slept on that, and am thinking that...what you are saying is: it's better to let her practice forage with the adults when she is at an age where, if she does take off with them, she has a better chance of survival.

Do I have that right ? Or am I still off.....???

Yes, you have that right. Let her forage with them when you're sure she is capable of being on her own. You have an ideal situation where she has a ready-made flock she can join and you will be able to see how she is doing. Don't be surprised if she lands on you sometimes after she is released. Sure wish I had a similar situation for when we release ours.

I apologize for not being clearer - sometimes I don't understand what I'm saying!

[Jaye]

Thanks again, all. I have been following your advice, she/he is doing well.

Attached is a funny lil' pic....is this typical ? One of the wild adults from the front of my house apparently has taken a liking to the baby. It actually hangs out with it a lot when I put her outside to observe other pigeons foraging ! This adult is not her mom or dad, incidentally...just another neighborhood pigeon.

Sits on her cage, sometimes just perches on the wall of my porch right next to the cage...for quite a while.

My girlfriend was over the other night when I was syringe-feeding, and she decided to put the cup of mixed formula up the the little one's face.

The pidgie dove right it, up to the end of it's beak, and started just eating (well, siphoning) the formula out all by himself !

Then did the same thing with a small dish of water.

Charis, you had said they will let you know when they are tired of handfeeding. I didn't believe that...but now I see what you mean. She is beginning to prefer the solid food (seed) as opposed to me syringe-feeding her. She is eating about 3-4 teaspoons of seed/day now.... Although I still get in about 8 cc's a day just to make sure she's getting enough nourishment.

I guess it won't be long now until release...she's looking more like a pigeon every day (every hour, actually). The tail feathers are getting longer now.

[Reti]

That is such a cute pic of your little pijies friend watching over her.


Reti

[littlecakes]

So cool!

[Trees Gray]

What a cute bird, sometimes the sound of a squeaker will bring the attention of other birds, I have had some even trying to feed them.

Thank you for taking such good care of her/him and enabling him a wonderful life.

[Jaye]

Well, I should thank you all for all of the help and support I am getting...we are lucky to have found this forum.

She's beginning to hop-fly now...and today she discovered if she can make it to my windowsill...she can see her brethren out in the lightwell (from whence she came). Here's a pic of her w/ a brother-sister pair (outside the window ~ yup, they are brother-sister, hatched and grew up together... their glorious Dad was light grey/rose, and their awesome Mom was dark grey/silver).

Brother and sister, and their older sib as well as their Mom and Dad...are a story unto themselves...but for another day.

So...the squeaker....he/she is 33 days old now, give or take a day. How much longer now ? At what age are they capable of full flight ? (I read somehwere online that it's 6 weeks ~ is this so ? ) And once they are, how much longer do I keep her here before going ahead w/ the release ????

[Jaye]

Hello.

My lil' friend is between 36-40 days old now. She's no longer eating handfed formula...strictly seed and water.

She loves getting a spritz-shower !

I am still leving her cage outside on the porch when I am home...she has a regular gaggle of neighborhood pigeon visitors...and that one friend who still sits with her (on top of the cage).

She is itching to get out now. She is flapping a lot...feathers look to be all in. In comparison to an adult pigeon, she looks pretty grown-up now. When her friends take off from my porch...she jumps and laps and wants to go with them.

She does a little free-flying in my kitchen 2x/day when I am changing the cage. usually ends up here (top shelf, 9' off of the floor !) where she can gaze upon her temporary digs :



So...my question becomes...WHEN ? I am guessing she's about ready for her soft release . How many more days should I wait ?