Joy and sorrow

[Pisciottano]

Back at home in Epinal, France, I was happy to discover a nest on the floor of one of my balconies with two lovely pigeonots about three weeks old. This was 3 days ago. For the moment I have only seen one parent come to feed them so I gather it is the father as I suppose the mother was already busy with another nest somewhere else. But this morning it seemed to me one of the babies had adopted a strange actitude as if he was sleeping with his head on the edge of the nest is eyes closed. When their father came to feed them and that little one didn't move I realized something was definitely wrong. He was dead of course. On his back at the base of his neck there was a big hollow depression and his beak was open. Could it be that his father tread on him accidentally and broke his neck? What do you think, does this happend often?

I feel terribly sorry for the other baby who is now alone. When I removed the dead bird he only flapped his wings a litte but did not try to bite me, he didnt even make a noise. I have named him Joy since his brother/sister is evidently my sorrow.

The nest is clean inside but around it the droppings have accumulated. I haven't dared do any cleaning as these birds do not know me yet. In my previous experiences I was present from the time the eggs were laid so both the parents and the babies knew me well. What do you think, should I clean around the nest?

[Feefo]

I am so sorry, Gladys! I have so little experience of squabs that I can't clarify anything, but when I had a wood pigeon being raised by a feral couple the baby died under its foster father. The father had one foot missing and at the time I wondered whether he could have accidentally stepped too heavily on the baby.

I hope Joy thrives.

Cynthia

[Maggie-NC]

Gladys, I'm really sorry to read about the baby. I know you were excited to come home and see another nest on your balcony. It is hard to determine what happened. I know that sometimes when a pigeon dies, whether it is a baby or adult, they will stretch out their necks and hang them over the side of their nest just before they pass on. I have often thought they were just trying to get an additional breath.

I know you will keep an eye on Joy. Could you intervene and raise her if necessary? You know we would help all we could.

[Pisciottano]

Thanks Cynthia and Maggie,

Of course should it be necessary I would raise Joy myself and I know you people would guide me as necessary. For the moment Joy is fed by at least one of the parents and seems to be in good health. However both these babies looked to me as being less lively than those I've seen grow in my balcony in the past. For instance they never got so excited or made loud noises when the parents approached them to feed them. I remember in the past I would always know when the parents came to feed them because of the fuss the little ones would make.

Another thing that intrigues me is that some of the droppings around the nest are an unusual color, like a bit rose or rusty. Could this be blood? At first I thought it had to do with the food they got from their parents but since one of the babies died I have begun to wonder. Now it is 9 o'clock in the evening but tomorrow I am going to clean all the poop around the nest and see if the coloured droppings reappear.

Finally, I haven't dared putting the plants out in that balcony in case the change would chase the parents. What do you think. Had I better wait?
Sorry to be so ignorant but I would hate to do something to endanger the life of my little survivor. Gladys

[Trees Gray]

It might intimidate them, even though you aren't really moving the youngster, it probably would be best to wait to put the plants out to be on the safe side.

I'm SO sorry to hear about the other baby.

[Pisciottano]

Hello everybody,
Here I am fretting over Joy. He/she doesn't seem to react or behave like the other babies of his age I've known in the past. He never squeaks or make any other sound even when fed or when I move the nest around to change the plastic sheet under the nest. His eyes look bright enough though. I have been back four days now and I only saw who I presume to be the father three times which of course doesn't mean that he hasn't come when I was not looking. What really bothers me is that his droppings are not normal either in shape or colour.
They are black with a pink/rusty stain on them. I have never seen that before or heard you people describe anything like that. Today I cleaned all around the nest in the hope that those droppings were those of the baby who died. But unfortunately they have reappeared.

I have not been able to find any avian vet in the region here. Today is a holiday here but tomorrow I will 'phone a place in a town some kmts. from here where they sell birds and will ask them if they can direct me to an avian vet somewhere, otherwise I have no way to have the poop analysed.

Does anybody have any idea why the droppings should be pink? Perhaps this is a common occurrence I don't know about? I suppose that if the other baby hadn't died I wouldn't be so apprehensive. I will very much appreciate your opinions. Thanks a lot. Gladys

[Charis]

Gladys, I don't know but it could have something to do with what the parents are feeding. I could also be blood. One of my birds had orange poops yesterday after she had eaten some carrots.
The baby's demeanor is concerning.

[Maggie-NC]

Gladys, I'm sorry Joy is appearing to not feel well. The colored poop could be like Charis suggested - food the parents are feeding. About all I can advise is to keep a close eye on how often they are feeding it. Is it in a protected area? How cool is it where you are? Are you able to take a picture of the poops for us to look at?

[Pisciottano]

Hello everyone,
I have taken a photo of Joy's droppings and one of Joy but I don't remember anymore how to send them to you. Today I spent the whole morning telephoning all the vets in all the towns around Epinal where I live but even those who consider themselves avian vets will not take care of wild birds (read pigeons). I suggested that I would not bring the bird but would only ask them to do a fecal test............nothing doing. I will not waste your time with all the nonsense I have had to listen to whilst trying to convince them.

How often Joy is fed (by the one parent I have seen) I really don't know. He comes between 10 and 11 in the morning for sure but I have never seen him at any other time. Joy left his nest for the first time today but stayed right against it. I come out to him several times a day and talk to him quietly. Fortunately we are having a very mild spring (12°C at night and 25°C daytime something like 50 and 75 Farenheit). I would gladly bring him in at night but I am not sure he would appreciate it and then what if the parents come early in the morning and not find him? In normal times I get up about 7 but after my recent long trip from South America and the five hours difference between the two countries I'm still trying to catch up. Also trying to catch up with the mail which has accumulated during my 6 months absence. At this moment is well past midnight.

I haven't been out of the appartement since I arrived 5 days ago but tomorrow I will get some grains and try to feed the little one in case he is not been sufficiently fed. I will have to be discrete about it so as not to attract other pigeons. You might remember the bother I had before when I was reported by a neighbour for feeding the pigeons on the balcony.

Well I think it's time to bring this litany to a close. Good night to you all. Thanks for listening. Gladys

[mr squeaks]

I'm sorry to hear that Joy might not be doing so well, Gladys.

I hope your supplemental feeding will help!!

Please keep us posted and wishing you and Joy

Love and Hugs

Shi

[Pisciottano]

Here is some updating on Joy. After some vomit and/or diahrrea worrying episodes Joy started to progress slowly but surely. I have been supplementing dad's feeding with a grain mixture for doves that I had inside his nest in the hope these grains will not attract other pigeons or I will be in trouble. I must say Dad doesn't mind helping himself to it right under my nose.

I still think that Joy is not acting according to his age. He spends all day long inside the nest, doesn'show any curiosity for his sorroundings. He ony leaves his nest at night to sleep against the balcony door on a hard surface. He can stand and walk, even run after his father but what he likes best is staying right inside his nest. He lets me move the nest to one side with him inside when I change the plastic sheet under it. He squeaks so gently that it is almost inaudible. Doesn't make any other noise and doesn't show any signs of hostility or fear. He should be flying in a few days time but I just cannot image him being ready for it. In short, he looks healthy, he eats well, he can stand and walk and flap his wings but at almost five weeks of age he rarely leaves his nest during the whole day and when he does it is to place himself against the balcony door very close to the nest. Is there such a thing as a bird's depression?

[Trees Gray]

Hi Gladys,

I'm so sorry to hear Joy doesn't seem up to par. Have you tried to examin him closely and check down his throat? Do you see any lesions? Is there any stringy mucus inside? Does his wings seem off (one hang differently from the other) or is there any swelling around wing or leg joints? Does his keel bone stick out?

Without really seeing anything its really hard to even try to imagine what could be ailing him. The color of the poop is definitely off, I wonder if this youngster has worms....

[Maggie-NC]

Gladys, I'm glad Joy is still hanging in there. Isn't it amazing that he knows to go to a more secure area to sleep - even at his young age. I agree with Treesa that you should probably check his little throat for any cheesy looking deposits. Maybe with the father helping himself to the dove mix, the baby will get the benefit from better food. I sure hope so.

Thank you so much for the update. He has been in my thoughts and prayers.

[Pisciottano]

I forgot to mention that the poops have been quite normal for a while. I will try to pick up the courage to examine Joy. I am so afraid to upset him now that he seems to trust me. Is it a common occurrence that young birds beg food from a pigeon other than his parents? It happened yesterday after dad chased away a strange pigeon and the stranger came back later. It is particularly surprising to me because Joy took a long time to start begging from his own parents. Live and learn?

[Trees Gray]

I have actually had other couples try to feed another one's youngster, I have never seen any youngster in my loft beg from any bird other then a parent. Maybe they do out in the wild, sounds like he may be quite hungry.