parliament maybe proved wrong about hawks!!!

[tuxedobaby]

SCOTTISH Parliament bosses were warned that bringing in birds of prey to scare off pigeons could result in a "PR disaster" if the hawks began eating them alive in front of schoolchildren.

But it was suggested the parliament could "play up" the potential health risks associated with pigeons in a bid to win support for using the birds of prey.

The parliament announced last month that it had agreed a four-year falconry contract – costing £13,000 for the first year – to tackle the pigeon menace which has plagued the £414 million Holyrood building since it opened in 2004. Officials emphasised at the time that the hawks or falcons would be used to deter pigeons, not kill them. But documents released under freedom of information show there were concerns about the move.

In a report before the decision was made, parliament officials warned, under a section headed The Risks: "Several councils abandoned hawking when the hawks caught pigeons and began eating them in front of the public.

"As a wild animal there is no absolute guarantee the hawk would not attack and kill a pigeon. The hawks eat their prey while still alive. This would be a PR disaster if it happened in front of the school next to the parliament or perhaps at the public entrance."

Concluding there was evidence that hawking worked, the report said: "There are risks of negative publicity from animal rights groups, but perhaps by playing up the potential public health risks and by careful handling from MRO (Media Relations Office), this could be managed."

The documents also reveal that a four-week trial using birds of prey in the summer may not have been as successful as parliament officials claimed.

A report assessing the use of three different birds – a red-tailed hawk, a Harris hawk and a Saker falcon – said: "Both hawks were successful in flying to high points.

"The red tail was good at getting into some of the nooks and crannies, but often had problems on landing, failing to stop, and on one occasion flew into the windows of the Members' Restaurant."

The report also noted that care had to be taken because of the presence of baby pigeons: "Although the red tail had never killed, faced with easy pickings, there was always the risk."

The report added that measuring the success of the falconer was "perhaps more difficult than first imagined".

It said: "There was a perception that flying birds of prey would scare off pigeons and gulls, and a successful outcome (be] achieved fairly quickly. While in the immediate and short term the birds of prey unsettled other birds, in all probability they did not deter the nesting birds.

"Pigeons roosting on the building would fly off to a safe haven and after the falconer had moved away with his birds the pigeons were observed returning to their nests."

The report said that towards the end of the trial, there did appear to be fewer pigeons on the MSP block. But it added: "This may have been a perception rather than a fact."



The full article contains 522 words and appears in Edinburgh Evening News newspaper.Page 1 of 1

myself and others wrote to scottish parliament recently regarding the use of hawks,now maybe they are starting to listen,of course it would be very upsetting for hawk to eat pigeons if visitors are there,so it may be a case of "back to the drawing board "for parliament,they have really got it in for the lovely pigeons who roost in the area,whatever plans they come up with which are inhumane or silly,be assured ill continue to oppose,i feel some of our protests and letters have maybe been listened to for a change

[george simon]

Now you must write those people in Parliament telling them the you and other bird lovers will be voting against them in the next election. You all must understand that those in power fear losing that power. You can also point out that the lord mayor of LONDON I believe his name is LIVINGSTON was voted out in part for his policy on the pigeons in in LONDON in which he also hired a falconer to do the same thing that your Parliament want to do.GEORGE

[tuxedobaby]

i have already signed petition against the use of BOPs in trafalger square,,the scottish parliament have really got it in for the pigeons(of which,,it must be said,are not that many)im not sure what boris johnsons(new lord mayor of london) stance is on trafalger square but im going to try and find out

[RodSD]

Maybe these politicians should ask fanciers how they control population in their own loft and they can tell them to use fake eggs!

[feralpigeon]

I noticed a new billboard for Burger King saying something like 'one world, one
burger'...please feel free to jump in and edit, lol....

How unusual that the concept of 'one world' could spring from human predatorship....anyway, the pain that one living creature goes through to
be the 'food chain' for another is always a deterrent to 'population control'
of this kind.

fp

[pigifan]

''There are risks of negative publicity from animal rights groups, but perhaps by playing up the potential public health risks and by careful handling from MRO (Media Relations Office), this could be managed.''

This is the disgusting thing about the politics of the so called 'pest' control business and politics in general.
It's all about PR, image, presentation.

I have always wondered if there isn't a way to make a hawk's talons harmless by fitting them with a cover. They used to make some sort of device for cat nails so that they won't damage carpets, furniture.

[tuxedobaby]

another idea which was proposed and promptly rejected by the powers that be,was to actually built a loft near parliament for the pigeons,a great idea but the "mess and pest"brigade were against it,so it was not to be,as i have said before our local paper is always harping on about the mess of pigeons in the city of edinburgh and giving the birds real negative publicity,id love to hook up with other pigeon lovers in the area to put our point across face to face at parliament

[GeeLily]

How ridiculous. How is building a coop MORE messy than letting them roost and nest anywhere they feel like? If a cat scratches the furniture, don't you give it a scratching post? Building attractive, easily hosed coops makes much more sense. Culling eggs becomes easy- which is a lot better pop. control than hawking. Hell, the Brits started eating squirrel to help control their numbers, why not some squab?
*L

[Jaye]

Just keep the pressure up....all animal rights groups in Scotrland and UK..... from what you write, this wasn't a unanimous cut-and-dry sort of approval.

One would have thought that Ken Livingston's failure at being re-elected would have given a bit of pause...but apparently the scots are going to have to make the same mistake and deal with the consequences that the very report on which they based their decision warns against.

[GeeLily]

I found this snippet in my travels googling 'pigeon tower':
"Ibn Battuta’s reference to pigeon towers in Isfahan is one of the earliest recorded. At one time there were as many as 3000 towers, but now that they have fallen into disuse only about 700 remain, some of which are quite elaborate. They all follow the same basic structure of round tower with pepperpot turret for the pigeons to fly in and out, no windows and only one door which was opened once a year to collect the manure. This manure - each tower held as many as 14,000 pigeons - was used as fertilizer for the melons which Ibn Battuta mentions, and for which the city is famous. Apparently it was also used in the manufacture of gunpowder..... ..."

I can tell you from personal experience, the fertilizer is incredible. Balanced 4-2-1 to 4-3-2 that won't burn plants.

[Gurbir]

I know this is a serious topic, but GeeLily! I wasn't hoping to see someone so close join here! Whats your name in real life? Do you have pigeons? If not, and if you want more i could hook you up with a few high flyers and rollers. I'm going into homers starting next saturday when i get my first 2 pairs donated by Nelson

[tuxedobaby]

Originally Posted by GeeLily

How ridiculous. How is building a coop MORE messy than letting them roost and nest anywhere they feel like? If a cat scratches the furniture, don't you give it a scratching post? Building attractive, easily hosed coops makes much more sense. Culling eggs becomes easy- which is a lot better pop. control than hawking. Hell, the Brits started eating squirrel to help control their numbers, why not some squab?
*L

my point exactly! where parliament is situated it is perfectly feasible to build a coop or attractive dovecote,there is a significant sized park(holyrood park)right behind the parliament in which a coop could easily be built.it costs parliament thousands of £ to "get rid of pigeons mess" so a coop which would probably cost considerably less is both practical and sensible for parliament and the pigeons.it saddens me that pigeons get such bad publicity in our country,i am continuing to write to our parliament on the pigeon subject and if needs be ill write to the scottish first minister as i really think its all wrong