urgent -- string removal

[sk8er]

Hi guys,
I found a pigeon with a baddly mauled foot with string, no blood though. I removed it after 2 sittings. I did not make it bleed. However, one of it toes (I guess) was so tightly tied that it made no blood go that finger and hence it became swoller. The nail in that finger became WHITE while all his other nails are black. To be honest it looks like that 1 toe is dead. Like a dead finger ..... BEFORE I removed his string he sometimes (not always0 stood on 1 leg because his other leg hurt. I havent seen him do that after the removal but was wondering if I should release him or take him to a vet. He really wants to go. I think he might have a mate or babies or something. Hes a grown bird. I just got him today.

[Pidgey]

Hard to say about the color of the toenail. There are plenty of pigeons that have different colored toenails. I've got one with one black one and all the rest are pink. I've got several others with different combinations and I don't even notice anymore because of the various mixes. Being swollen doesn't mean that it's going to die or fall off. If you don't think that the string cut in so deep as to cause a hemorrhage now or later then let him go.

Pidgey

[sk8er]

K. But I have removed strings before and This one is swollen and looks like a finger on a dead person. You know like the ones they show in movies .... WHat should I do ? I dont wann keep him because he is desperate but I dont want him to be in pain if I leave him ...

[Pidgey]

If the tissue is necrotic due to avascular necrosis (if it died because the blood supply was completely cut off), there won't be any pain--it's already over. What happens in a case like that is the appendage eventually dries up and falls off with very little discomfort.

What you're looking at is more than just the toe--the bird may, as you've pointed out, have a family that's depending on him and you have to weigh the lesser of the two evils and make the choice for the chicks that you don't know exist.

Pidgey

[Larry_Cologne]

(I started typing this post a half hour before Pidgey made her (ahem, before the matriarch made HIS) two posts, and posted it after hers (ahem, excuse me, His), so some of this is redundant).

My personal vote would be to let him go, since it is nesting season.

I've been dealing seriously with pigeons for only two years now. There are others in these forums who have far more experience than I do, and I think you should give priority to their opinions on this, if they post. I feel sure others will disagree with me, and I expect them to.

One member in these forums thought that pigeons frequently had problems with string-tangled feet because they were trying to use te string or thread as nesting material. My pigeons have tried to take nylon fishing line (2mm thick, for hanging oil paintings) for nesting material.

Here in Cologne, for a month or so this past winter (say, January and February), I saw very few pigeons with bad feet. This past month I have been seeing many more with bad feet. It is warmer, and diseases which were dormant may be activating (or maybe not). Some of the bad feet are from string problems, as evidenced by swollen toes, and places on the toe which look like a tourniquet had been applied.

I saw few if any pigeons with toes missing make it through either of the past two winters. I am assuming for now that the infection affecting the toes went on to spread through the rest of their bodies (systemic infection, or septicemia -- phil pdpbison will probably know).

When a human being has a lot of diseased flesh, or dead flesh (gangrene), it is a poison and can overwhelm the circulatory system (the blood and the lymphatic system, which carries off the bad stuff so it can be filtered out and disposed of. There can be suddenly too much to get rid of if a tourniquet or constriction is removed. I don't know if this is the case with pigeon feet.

I have seen some pigeons with bad feet I thought I could do little about. They are too quick for me, I am too slow for them. The trapping techniques I tried did not work very well, and I did not want to demonstrate trapping techniques to the wrong people. Putting out a lot of food to attract and distract the pigeons in order to trap one seemed counter-productive: it attracted too much unfavorable human attention, since feeding is prohibited. The pigeons generally do not want to be caught, since for all they know they are headed for a stewpot. If they could be aware that you want to help, would they want to come? If your ten-year-old neighbor kid invites you over to play "surgery" would you feel enthusiastic? If even your doctor says you need surgery, you might be hard to persuade.

Last summer I caught a very weak and starving female pigeon whose two legs were tangled with red cotton thread and effectively tied together, and she had to fly and flop her way to food. I caught her easily, and removed the thread very quickly with a scalpel which had a curved blade (sharp on the inside of the curve, or on the concave side, with a sharp edge on the other side near the point). One of her toes came off with some of the thead. She acted as if she felt very little in the damaged toes. Last summer (2005) I caught a very weak and starving female pigeon whose two legs were tangled with red cotton thread and effectively tied together, and she had to fly and flop her way to food. I caught her easily, and removed the thread very quickly with a scalpel which had a curved blade (sharp on the inside of the curve, or on the concave side, with a sharp edge on the other side near the point). One of her toes came off with some of the thead. She acted as if she felt very little in the damaged toes. Last summer (2005) I caught a very weak and starving female pigeon whose two legs were tangled with red cotton thread and effectively tied together, and she had to fly and flop her way to food. I caught her easily, and removed the thread very quickly with a scalpel which had a curved blade (sharp on the inside of the curve, or on the concave side, with a sharp edge on the other side near the point). One of her toes came off with some of the thead. She acted as if she felt very little in the damaged toes. We kept her a few days, fed her, and let her fly free in the house. She recuperated very fast, indicated she wanted to leave, and we let her go. A week later I saw her on the street, and all the swelling had gone down. Except for a missing toe or two, she would have been hard to recognize as the starving pigeon I had caught. I saw her maybe once after that.


I can understand most pigeons wanting to have little to do with humans. We are more often the problem than we are the solution.

[Pidgey]

Larry, it may interest you to know that not all gangrenes are created equal. True gangrene is caused by Clostridium spp. (perfringens is one of the most common, I think) where a highly lethal toxin is release that necrotizes the neighboring tissue. It's possible to have necrotic tissue that's not doing that. However, you're right about infections of the feet that can ultimately bring birds down because some pathogens live in and travel through the tendon sheaths (living on the synovial fluid) and can finally build to a population that can overtax the bird. Bumblefoot (pododermatitis) is a prime example of this pathogenic etiology.

Pidgey

[sk8er]

Thanks guys. I force feed him and let him go. He landed on a ledge and after a few minutes, he knew exactly where he was going. Hopefully home.... :-)

[Trees Gray]

Hi sk8er,

I just want to thank you for removing the string off of this birds foot. I'm sure it was a great relief for him and I hope he will do well.

I imagine he was anxious to go and you kindly were looking out for his best interest and obliged.

I'm curious as to why you force fed him....

[sk8er]

because i did not want him to fell hungry and neglect his babies / mate. Plus it was getting dark and knew he would not food atleast for another 12 hours. Just curious on how do bird acknowledge people. I have heard of
1. following people
2. tail wagging

any others....

[feralpigeon]

Hi sk8er,

Thanks for helping the string foot pigeon out. It can be a tough call as even when the string cuts through the outer layers of skin they seem resilient and tough enough to continue about their business. I have removed string from toes that didn't initially change their deformed appearance to notice with time they seemed to get partial or complete use back again. I think you did the right thing to let the bird go if the string hadn't cut through. Hopefully you'll see the pij again and be able to see for yourself if the toe comes back at all.
If there are further problems down the road, you may need to bring it to the rehabber that you work with.

How do they greet you, the pijies?

I have a couple who will greet me with a cadence of coos, one while bowing her head. Another who twitches her wing, one who tries to 'talk' back when I say hello, I think it depends on the circumstances. The ferals will fly in circles above me sometimes pretty high up when they see me and then come land at my feet. Sometimes one of them will spontaneously land on my head or arm, or what ever strikes their fancy--sometimes the bag of seed, lol. Sometimes they just come running up when the hear the alarm beep of the car or fly over from somewhere a block or so away.

Thanks again for helping the ferals in your area.

fp

[sk8er]

I love helping pijeons. So the pleasure was all mine. Hopefully I will see the little fella again .

[sk8er]

BTW. I noticed that they coo, not a mating coo but a different coo and when I show up they stop cooing. Then I give them some food . Do you think it is a food coo ....

[feralpigeon]

They do seem to be noisy until the food appears, there are a couple at home that seem to coo to show their appreciation....I can tell you that once the food is 'down', they get real quiet chowing down

fp

[sk8er]

and they coo back up again when it is finished. I have seen this cycle go on until they are satisfied or they leave. Kind of like kids....