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kayzee123 kayzee123 is offline
Posted 4th December 2003, 04:27 AM
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Stratford, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 49
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Pigeon Pox--Need advice


Since pigeons are relatively new patients here, I've never had to deal with pox before.

The pij has the dipthiritic version, complete with a bad case of conjunctivitus. I'm managing to get liquid food down his throat, and the sores in there don't seem to be getting any worse.But now the eyes seem to be suffering the worst. The subcutaneous swelling around both eyes is still increasing and the pij is barely able to open them. The head is showing a marked change in shape as this swelling continues.

There are no external sores.

I need to know just how bad the swelling can get and if this swelling is the pre-cursor to the cutaneous variety of pox. I'm trying to assess the suffering level of the bird.

His energy level is reasonable. He still has some strength and fights being held.

Kaaryn


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TAWhatley TAWhatley is offline
Posted 4th December 2003, 07:29 AM
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Lake Forest, CA, USA
Age: 66
Posts: 21,031
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Kaaryn,

Are you sure the lesions inside are pox and not canker (trichomoniasis)? It is possible for a pigeon to have both pox and canker at the same time.

Having never had a bird with the wet type of pox, I can't offer any sound information as to how much swelling may occur or what the level of discomfort may be for the bird.

Here is a link to some good information regarding pox:

http://www.michigan.gov/dnr/0,1607,7...6362--,00.html


Terry Whatley


[This message has been edited by TAWhatley (edited December 04, 2003).]
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kayzee123 kayzee123 is offline
Posted 4th December 2003, 08:46 AM
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Stratford, Ontario, Canada
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Yes, we're sure it's pox. The vet did a swab. It's viral and from all descriptions, wet pox.

I've been checking many sites and know the lesions in the mouth can cause suffocation if the tissue gets too inflamed. I'm keeping an eye on the bird's breathing. But I'm also concerned about the pressure that must be building around the eyes. I've read two conflicting reports--one says bathe the eye with a 1-2% saline solution, and the other says any attempts to treat th eyes may further spread the virus to other parts of the body. So I'm trying to leave the eyes untouched.

Thanks for the site. I will check that one out.

Kaaryn
dpowell
Posted 4th December 2003, 09:40 AM
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HI there. Just got through treating two with pox. From what I've read, the "illness" feeling is prior to the lesion breakout. The lesions look worse than they are. My birds took about 4 weeks for all the lesions to dry up and fall off and there was no blindness (it covered the eyes).

Yes they can have wet pox too that can close the mouth up. You can carefully try to wipe these out regulary with a qtip, but be very careful, they can bleed. If they aren't too big, it may be a mute point. If you see them getting bigger in the throat, then try to do this carefully.

Keep us posted and good luck! ONce they get over this awful thing, they will usually become immune for life. Give them good supportive care, vitamins, good 12 hours of dark/rest, good food (pigeon food). If you can get the eye ointment at Foy's PIgeons supply that may help with secondary bacterial infections in the eye, which is what I used.

Good luck!
Fred Fred is offline
Posted 4th December 2003, 12:32 PM
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 162
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Kaaryn,
I'm not doubting this is pox but I don't understand how a bird can be affected with it in December. There's no harm in putting a canker medication down along with what else you are doing to try and help. Pox many times brings a canker infection along with it.
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Skyeking Skyeking is offline
Posted 4th December 2003, 12:34 PM
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Tea tree oil is a great way to dry up the pox lesions, & you can use a drop of colloidal silver (natural antibiotic) in each eye to clear up a bacterial infection.
Treesa
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kayzee123 kayzee123 is offline
Posted 5th December 2003, 05:18 AM
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Stratford, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 49
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When the vet checked the swab under the microscope, he didn't find any trichomoniasis or bacterial bodies. However, I'm willing to give everything and anything to this bird to try and help. What would be suggested as treatment?

Also, the tea tree oil, is that for external lesions only? The colloidal silver, is that through a vet or through a pet store? I have the bird on erthromycin with vitamins and amino acids. A topical eye ointment, again, is that only through a vet or available through a pet store?

As for removing lesions inside the mouth, the swellings appears to be under the tissue in the mouth. Not accessible for removal. If the tissue becomes necrotic, I will gently remove it if possible.

Thanks all! This little guy is putting up a good fight.

Kaaryn

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Skyeking Skyeking is offline
Posted 5th December 2003, 07:13 AM
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Hi Kaaryn,

The tea tree oil is for external lesions only, It dries up the lesions quickly, they are gone in a few days. It dries up pimples, and my son uses it, too!

You can get the tea tree oil & liquid coloidal silver at any health food store. It is great! You can use it long term without any loss of gut bacteria. A drop a day in each eye for lesions around the eye, or any problem in the eye. My rehabber treated one of my pigeons with it when she lost her eye. I still use it once in a while on her, when her eye hole looks teary.

You can put a drop or two down the beak daily as an antibiotic. They don't build a resistance to it. Treesa
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Fred Fred is offline
Posted 5th December 2003, 07:30 AM
Join Date: May 2003
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Can you contact www.jedds.com and order Spartrix or equivalent? These are pills for individualized canker (trichamonis gallinae) that can put be down the throat.
One pill a day for three days will kill all canker in the system.
cats6birds4 cats6birds4 is offline
Posted 5th December 2003, 03:34 PM
Join Date: Oct 2003
Country: United States
Location: Ventura, CA, USA
Posts: 50
Question

I don't want to butt in, but I'm concerned/curious about the tea tree oil for the lesions. It seems so strong, and I would be afraid to get it near the eyes. I use tea tree oil all the time for various cuts/burns etc. for myself, and it can really sting bad if you get it near your eyes or nose, even just a drop. I've read that it should always be diluted when using it on pets, so I've been pretty cautious with it. I'm curious as to how others have used it. Thanks, and Im thinking good thoughts for your sweet bird.
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Skyeking Skyeking is offline
Posted 6th December 2003, 05:28 AM
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Hi cats6birds4,

The tee trea oil is only for external lesions, and NOT to be used near eyes or nose. The coliodal silver can be used in the eye. Sorry, if I didn't make myself clear enough. Treesa
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Every negative event effects my ability to own my APBT, please be a responsible owner and keep your pitbull out of trouble.
kayzee123 kayzee123 is offline
Posted 6th December 2003, 05:23 PM
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Stratford, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 49
Unhappy

I'm sorry to say, I had to have the little bird put down today. The swelling in the mouth and throat had grown to the point the little guy could barely swallow drops of fluid. His breathing was getting laboured and his energy was diminishing rapidly. I could not let him suffer any longer, nor did I want him to suffer from suffocation, which was the direction it looked to be heading.

Our local OSPCA has a wonderful vet tech who firmly believes in no pain or suffering in the process, so the little pij went gently.
I held him until it was over.

Thank you all for your encouragement and help.

On the bright side, I have two healthy pigeons thriving and the one with an injured wing is gaining altitude every day. The other, a fledgling, is growing by leaps and bounds.
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TAWhatley TAWhatley is offline
Posted 6th December 2003, 05:53 PM
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Lake Forest, CA, USA
Age: 66
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Hi Kaaryn,

I'm very sorry things worked out as they did, but I know you did the right and best thing for the bird. Glad to hear the others are doing so well.

Terry Whatley
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Skyeking Skyeking is offline
Posted 7th December 2003, 03:06 AM
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Hi Kaaryn,

Sorry, to hear about the little bird.

I had only one baby I had to put down,after discussing it with my rehabber. I couldn't be there, my husband had to take this pigeon to our avian vet, to be put to sleep. I cry too much in that kind of situation, which the pigeon would pick up on, and therefore would not be at peace when it went into spirit world. I would not want that stress on any animal, at that point in its life.

I'm glad you are so brave...Treesa
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Every negative event effects my ability to own my APBT, please be a responsible owner and keep your pitbull out of trouble.
 

Tags
avian vet, bacterial infection, bacterial infections, colloidal silver, gut bacteria, injured wing, pet store, pigeon food, secondary bacterial infections



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