Pigeons with missing toes

[Laurel Rain]

Hello All,

After reading much of Fred's info on pigeons with missing toes, I have found myself looking at every pigeon i see for this affliction. One day, about a week ago, i saw one missing both his middle toes. I tried to get near him to examine further, but he would not let me get very close. Otherwise, he seemed fine. There didn't appear to be any string around his toes or anything, they were just gone.

I wanted to know, does anyone think that this pigeon and others who are missing their toes are in a lot of pain? Can they live fairly good lives without toes??? Was there anything i could have done?

Thank you everyone, take care

Laurel

[singing birdy]

hi I herd once about a pigeon who was born with 4 legs 2 on its back and two underneith him mabe the pigeon was born with missing tows!!!!!!!!!

[John_D]

Hi,

When they lose toes through getting something tight round them, or round the feet, the blood supply goes and the toes usually 'die' and drop off. Far as I'm aware, if the offending thread goes with the toe (or foot) the bird will not suffer further pain. (Not sure, actually, how much feeling they have in the feet anyway - anyone?) They can cope pretty well with this - I have one now who comes to feed, and has no toes on one foot and only two on the other. They are at a disadvantage, obviously, because they do walk a lot while foraging - but if there's food around, they can usually get some. Personally, I doubt they will survive as long as undamaged birds unless conditions are very favorable in their particular patch. Nothing you can do if there is no sign of any further entanglement.

John

[fred2344]

Hi Laurel,
After they lose the toe/toes, there is a substantial reduction in discomfort. From what I see out there, there doesn't appear to be any pain.
The problem is that it takes a very long time for this terrible process to go from beginning to end, perhaps as long as a year in some cases. During that time, there is a great deal of pain and so that is why I immediately go after them when feeding the flock. If it isn't bad yet, I'll take the string off right then and there but if it is a bad situation, I take them home and work very carefully to get the string off. Then I put them on an antibiotic and keep the wounds clean.
I made a mistake once and misjudged the severity of the wound. I took string off and let the bird go. About a month later, I saw the same bird limping. The toe was coming off and obviously causing pain. I grabbed the bird and in doing so, the toe did fall off right then and there but I took him home anyway and when I put him in a cage, I discovered he wasn't limping anymore. So the pain does go away.
The thing to watch out for the most is a bird that has string wrapping both legs together. They trip over themselves on the ground or lie down when they land because the string is interfering with their movements very badly.
If I get a bird where the cuts have just started, after taking off the string, the bird can stop limping in about 5 days. One of these days you will see a bird that has string and severe injury to the foot and that is going to break your heart.
I don't really know if they pick up the string while walking on the ground or if it is intertwined with the sticks of wood they use to make a nest. Perhaps in sitting on eggs and moving around, the string wraps around the foot.
A particular situation that happened once was one that did not involve string. I grabbed a bird that had paper tape wrapped around both legs and holding them close together. He spent a few days with me, building back up with good food. The very first thing he did was to raise one leg and let is rest. A little while later, he switched and lifted the other foot.
I am so thankful that I managed to spot this one. They do get themselves into trouble.

[Laurel Rain]

Hi All,

Thank you for your replies. So, Fred, If i do see a pigeon in real trouble, with string wrapped around his feet, what do I do? How do you "grab" them? Are they particularly slow because of the string handicap?

Also, didn't you say in an earlier posting that if you remove the string, they can lose blood quickly?

So, say i find a pigeon with this affliction, do i take care of him myself, despite my inexperience. i suppose i could always consult with all of you.
Thanks,

Laurel

[fred2344]

Hi Laurel,
I am going to paste something I wrote on another post about string but first, you asked a couple of questions;
Pigeons that are injured can be faster and more evasive than non-injured. Many times, they are much harder to capture. I never use a net but while feeding the flock and when I'm in grabbing range, slowly approach the bird from behind and then try to get it with one hand. I won't use a net because I'm afraid of hurting another bird with the metal edges. There are so many times that the bird spots me and flies away and that is not good because the chances are that the bird is not going to allow me to approach too closely again. They have very good memories.
Anyone trying to remove string has to be exceptionally careful because of the potential for heavy bleeds. It has happened to me many times and there are always cotton balls and a congealant next to me before I start. Most of the time, pressure on the source of the bleed can stop it but you have to know where the bleeding is coming from. You could put the pressure on one spot that is dripping blood when it is really another place that is the source and the blood is following the easiest route out, along the cuts. YOu can be fooled by that.
Once or twice, a toe that was already half off started a heavy bleed and I couldn't reach the source of it because the toe was in the way so I had to cut it off to reach the source and apply pressure. The toe was going to come off anyway and this had to be done to stop a potentially deadly bleed. (Birds can lose 75% of their blood before going into shock but there is no way that I'm going to test the validity of what I have read about it).I'm afraid to use an electric cautery because of the shock effect to the bird.
Here is the post I made:
String:
Have you ever seen a pigeon that has missing toes or even a missing leg? The chances are that the digits and/or leg were lost from string being wrapped around them.
I can't think of anything more horrible than that happening to a bird. Imagine tying a rubber band around your finger as tightly as you can. You know what kind of pain there will be. You can take off the rubber band. The pigeon cannot take off the string. They can't walk up to anyone and ask for help. They suffer great pain and it can take over a year before the pain goes away along with the toe(s) or foot or leg.
For me, this affliction represents the symbol of humanity's neglect of the natural world. String as thin as nylon thread to wrapping string is all discarded on the ground. Pigeons walking on that ground will get it wrapped around their feet. The string curls and twirls around a toe or more digits and knots form. They begin to tighten and start to cut into the skin. Then when the string cuts though all the skin and muscle and tendons, it begins to tighten around the bone.
A dry type of gangrene forms. the toe begins to die from lack of circulation. Lack of circulation affects the other toes and they begin to curl into a permanent contorted postition. Eventually, the toe falls off or if the string is wrapped around the leg, that falls off. If anything falls off prematurely, the bird will bleed to death. And throughout this process, the bird is limping in pain and trying to survive.
String can wrap around and tie both legs together so if you see a bird lying down on the ground and eating, that could very well be the cause.
An injured bird will be far more reluctant to allow a person to approach within grabbing distance and that makes it much tougher to get it. I have gone for more than a month trying to capture any particular bird with string wrapped around it.
If you get one, the trouble is just beginning. You need a pair of magnifying glasses even if your eyesight is good. You have to get as close as possible to the site to see what is going on. One wrong move and the bird can begin to bleed heavily. Pressure can stop the bleed but try to find the right point when you are working in blood and twisted contorted flesh that no longer resembles a foot.
You need a good strong light similar to the tensor lamps. You need dental type picks and those can be purchased at a number of hardware stores. They have different tops and straight picks are not always the right ones to use. You need a good pair of small surgical scissors and a good pair of tweezers. You need small Exacto type knives. There has to be cotton, cotton swabs and something like Quik Stop to try to stem any bleeding. Finally, you need Betadyne to disinfect the area when you are done. All of this has to be available before even starting to work on the string.
Pulling on the string up from one side is simply going to pull the string on the other side more deeply into the tissue. The picks have to be placed under the string and a knife used to cut it. Tweezers are used to unravel the string which can be wrapped around the inside of the wound a few times. When you hit a point where you can't unwind the string, you are at another knot and have to work with the dental pick again. If you can find other loose ends on the other side of the digit, cut wherever you safely can and maybe you will get lucky and the string will be able to be pulled out in pieces.
Incidentally, if you are working alone, one hand is holding the bird while you are tring to use your other hand to work with the tools.
Don't be surprised if you find that as you unravel the string, it may follow all the way around the foot or ankle from places where you didn't even realize there were cuts.
Sometimes all that is holding the toe to the body is the string and in taking the string off, the toe could come off with it. If there is still a blood supply, expect to apply pressure to the stump constantly for at least 40 minutes to stop a major bleed.
If you are fortunate enough to get all the string off, your work is not finished.
I once had a bird where the string was wrapped around an area above the ankle and below the knee(hock joint). That part of the leg was going to come off and if it came off too early, the bird would bleed to death. After the string was off, I fashioned a wire splint that wrapped around the bottom of the foot and taped to an area above the wound so the leg could not fall off until it was time. When it did, I kept the bird until it healed and then released it. He did very nicely for a few years.
What do you do about the remaining toes that are curled from lack of circulation? Trace an outline of the bottom of the foot and cut out a piece of plastic coffee can cover to match. Cut small notches in each piece for the toe nails and place the fitted plastic on the bottom of the foot. Tape each toe to the plastic piece and tape the center of the foot to hold the entire device. You may have to stretch the toe in order to make it fit but that is the whole point. Straightening out the toes can take three weeks or longer but they have to be stretched by this device or it isn't going to work.
Sometimes, if one toe is involved, there is no curling of the others but the toe can be dying from lack of circulation. The toe dies from the top down so that if there is still circulation at the base and the bird accidentally hits the toe, it can break off prematurely and cause a major bleed. If I can release the bird save that one condition, what I do is cut off that part of the toe that is dead so that only a small stump remains and the bird can be safely released without my having to worry about another injury happening. If there is still circulation in the toe, I wait until it disappears and then cut with the surgical scissors. It's dead tissue and the nerves are gone so the bird feels nothing.
There can be pus pockets in the foot or not. In any case, I give an antibiotic.

------------------
"Until he extends the circle of compassion to all living things, man will not himself find peace."

Albert Schweitzer

[crackedcorn]

I remember seeing a pigeon with string wrapped many times around the base of its foot. There was nothing I could do to help it. I also saw another pigeon limping around with a missing right foot. Anyway, thanks for the great information.