He's a pigeon, not a football!

[Teresa]

Originally Posted by learning

Being a teacher for the last 18 years this type of behavior is, unfortunatly, all too common. The biggest difference between kids now and kids 20 years ago is that parenting seems to have become an exercise in being the child's friend instead of being the child's parent. Children need to learn boundaries. We all pushed the baundaries as kids. It is normal. The only problem is when those boundaries are not clearly stated. We have spent far too much time and effort worrying about children's self esteem and far too little time worrying about teaching children right and wrong. Every day I get older is a day that I appreciate my parents more. I guess that too is normal.

Anyway, I do not blame these children at all. They are doing what all children do. Figuring out how far they can push the envelope. I blame the parents for not defining how far that envelope goes.

As always, just my two cents.

Dan

Couldn't agree more. If the children can't learn from their parents which behaviours are socially acceptable and which are not, they will grow up to be, at best, maladjusted, at worst, sociopaths.

[ND Cooper]

Some day, when those kids are introduced to pigeons, as a hobby or sport, they will remember their (first?) encounter with a pigeon, and feel pretty bad about what they did.
Kids need education and guidence, (some parents too!) with all you can give, they will still make mistakes.
Book learning is manditory, but theres nothing better than actual hands on experiance.
I guess it just shows us, how many people out there, really don't know beans about Pigeons.

[Charis]

Originally Posted by ND Cooper

Some day, when those kids are introduced to pigeons, as a hobby or sport, they will remember their (first?) encounter with a pigeon, and feel pretty bad about what they did.
Kids need education and guidence, (some parents too!) with all you can give, they will still make mistakes.
Book learning is manditory, but theres nothing better than actual hands on experiance.
I guess it just shows us, how many people out there, really don't know beans about Pigeons.

How will they ever be introduced to pigeons in another way? Without the parents as a guide,telling them their actions were wrong and cruel, they will never get it and only pass the same on to any children they may have in the future.

[ND Cooper]

Think positive!
Some day they might get to visit world of wings, or maybe someone from the AU or NPA might visit their school.
How about one of our own pigeon lofts?

[Charis]

I think they are in the UK.

[ND Cooper]

What better place to learn about pigeons! (War Pigeons)

[Charis]

Originally Posted by ND Cooper

What better place to learn about pigeons! (War Pigeons)

Well I'm glad you are so hopeful for these boys. I'll leave it to you to carry enough hope for the both of us.

[philodice]

Originally Posted by Teresa

This is Rufus today. He's SO much better! And just look at those eyes -- this baby is no push-over!



By the way, what does he want when he starts nibbling at the gaps between my fingers and ignoring the food in my hand? Is he asking for crop milk?

Yup, I'd say he still wants a little parental love. Maybe pop some seeds in his beak.
He has this lovely bronze color on his chest. I think your rescue babie is lovely!
He looks like a fighter. I wonder if this bird will ever forgive and forget? Pigeons have a memory for faces, places, and details better than most criminal witnesses, and he will recognize those kids until the day he dies. Too bad he can't testify.

[ND Cooper]

Charis, Please don't give up hope on your own species, Otherwise what chief Seattle said will come true.
Education is the key to mankind's sucess!

[Charis]

Originally Posted by ND Cooper

Charis, Please don't give up hope on your own species, Otherwise what chief Seattle said will come true.
Education is the key to mankind's sucess!

I totally agree with you intellectually. Emotionally, I feel raw right now. Believe me, I do a lot of education through the Humane Society. For the most part, the children that come to the Humane Society do so because their parents are supportive. Without that...you see where I'm headed with my thought process.
I do appreciate you optimism.. honestly and that does give me hope.

[ND Cooper]

Ok.
Parents are very, very important.
In my situation, all my parents taught me about pigeons was to stay away from them, I could get sick.
Then I stumbled upon a book in the library called: A Fancy For Pigeons
I was 36 years old.
The piont is, children, no matter what age, don't learn everything from their parents.
That's where we can help. (Society)

[maryjane]

Originally Posted by learning

Being a teacher for the last 18 years this type of behavior is, unfortunatly, all too common. The biggest difference between kids now and kids 20 years ago is that parenting seems to have become an exercise in being the child's friend instead of being the child's parent. Children need to learn boundaries.

Dan

Ain't that the truth. I don't know how many times I've had to run kids off when they were chasing and kicking and throwing rocks at the pigeons and other birds at the river. Most of the time their parents just stood there, letting them "play", as one parent told me. I admit I've been in my fair share of arguments with some of those ignorant parents (go figure). Like Dan said, they're so often trying to be "friends" instead of parents, either that or they just don't care a lot of the time, which is even sadder.

That little bird looks A LOT better today, I'm so glad! I know he'll thrive in your care. Thanks a lot for looking out for him and taking him to a safe home.

[Teresa]

Originally Posted by Charis

I think they are in the UK.

We're in Portugal, where most pigeons have (at present, not historically) a miserable life, and the attackers were tourists from Spain, where pigeons fare even worse. I heard that falcons had been introduced in the major Spanish cities to 'control' the pigeon populations. If that's the official view, how do you educate people like that?

Besides, the real problem here is not restricted to pigeons and how much people know about them, but rather a lack of compassion and respect for all life forms. Busy, permissive parents who fail to point out to their kids that living beings have a right to live and to thrive, they are not fluffy toys they can pull apart and destroy, needn't be surprised when their offspring turn their violence on them.
Whether it's kicking pigeons, throwing cats off a castle wall to see if they'll land on their feet (yes, it happened, 10 Km away from here) or putting a whole litter of puppies in a plastic bag in the bin because you're too selfish to have your dog spayed, we're talking about crimes against life itself and breeding monsters who will simply 'erase' anything that stands in their ruthless way.

[Teresa]

Originally Posted by philodice

Yup, I'd say he still wants a little parental love. Maybe pop some seeds in his beak.
He has this lovely bronze color on his chest. I think your rescue babie is lovely!
He looks like a fighter. I wonder if this bird will ever forgive and forget? Pigeons have a memory for faces, places, and details better than most criminal witnesses, and he will recognize those kids until the day he dies. Too bad he can't testify.

Thank you so much, I'll try doing that.
And yes, he's a fighter alright! When I cleaned his poops a moment ago, he pecked the living daylights out of my hands, eyes flashing. If he was the size of a person, I'd like to see the look on those kids' faces...

[Charis]

Originally Posted by Teresa

We're in Portugal, where most pigeons have (at present, not historically) a miserable life, and the attackers were tourists from Spain, where pigeons fare even worse. I heard that falcons had been introduced in the major Spanish cities to 'control' the pigeon populations. If that's the official view, how do you educate people like that?

Besides, the real problem here is not restricted to pigeons and how much people know about them, but rather a lack of compassion and respect for all life forms. Busy, permissive parents who fail to point out to their kids that living beings have a right to live and to thrive, they are not fluffy toys they can pull apart and destroy, needn't be surprised when their offspring turn their violence on them.
Whether it's kicking pigeons, throwing cats off a castle wall to see if they'll land on their feet (yes, it happened, 10 Km away from here) or putting a whole litter of puppies in a plastic bag in the bin because you're too selfish to have your dog spayed, we're talking about crimes against life itself and breeding monsters who will simply 'erase' anything that stands in their ruthless way.

Glad to know where you live. I was pretty sure you are not in the States or Canada.
Similar atrocities happen here too. I'm so glad you have the bird.