law enforcement officer came today...

[jang786]

heres another one

[JGregg]

Are you getting this from the Stockton City website? You may need to check at City Hall. When did you put your aviary up?

[jang786]

Originally Posted by JGregg

Are you getting this from the Stockton City website? You may need to check at City Hall. When did you put your aviary up?

yes i am checking it from the link u provided and i am about to call the code regulation deparment, i put up my loft 5 months ago..

[jang786]

i called the code regulation department and one of the lady said that you cannot keep any wild domesticated animals in your house and i told her that these are not wild pigeons they r homing pigeons but she didnt listen to me and said that i dont have time to talk to u and will send an officer to my house.. it even says on that website that u could keep homing pigeons.

[Jaye]

Jiang...don't worry. My suggestion would be to contact IDF...In Defense of Animals. they are a legal organization based in Mill Valley. Google them. CALL them, don't e-mail, they take too long to reply to e-mails. Call 2-3x/day if necessary...they are good, helpful people, but they are a small-staffed organization so sometimes their response time isn't the quickest.

Call the Planning or Zoning or Municipal Development Office and ASK what is the most current years for table 3-14...is it the 2004 version ? If so, I think you are good, from the Zoning/Development standpoint. So that gives you some pushback.

I am used to reading codes, it appears the Municipal code says you are allowed 10 pigeons (again, unless a newer version of table 3-14 has been adopted since 2004 which states otherwise). So, maybe call the Health Dept. and ask them if there are any applicable codes . Don't say "I have a bunch of pigeons on my property and I wanna know if it's legal ".. NEVER approach speaking to a governing authority by telling them the whole story.

Ask it like " I am considering adding a small interior loft to my property to keep my homing pigeons...are there any applicable Health codes regarding this ?"

My guess is, Health Code will allow some (if it addresses the issue at all, which it might NOT) I doubt HIGHLY that health code BANS pigeon keeping under all circumstances. So if both Health and Municipal codes allow some...you are gonna be OK...Okay ?

You can also look up your local humane societies and speak to someone there. I think Delta Humane Society covers Stockton ? Again...don't blurt out your whole story....just ask them what codes and sections refer to the keeping of homing pigeons and pet doves. Then ask them to refer you to an animal rights lawyer.

If table 3-14 is the only governing code, and you have more than 10 pigeons, you will need to relocate some for a week or two in the event that an officer comes back.

Right now, having dealt with similar stuff before...I can tell you that the police dept. is just being lazy and bullying; they have not gone about this the right way and therefore, most definitely, you have MORE time than 1 week (and you very likely DON'T have to empty your property of all birds..certainly not so quickly). I really hate enforcement authorities that do this, they just bully people around and withhold information on actual laws and codes, even though they know damn well they do not have the power to do so....just hoping they can intimidate someone....just so you will do what they say so the problem will go away and they don't have to deal with it anymore....My girlfriend used to work in the Public Defenders office....it is amazing how many stories she has told me where enforcement officers very knowingly just overstep their bounds knowing damn well it's not within their power to do so.

You have many, many options available to you. Don't panic, don't stress.

Do you or any friends of yours know a lawyer ? ANY lawyer, in any field of law ? Someone who could write a letter saying they represent you, and "according to sec. xxx of the xxx code, it is legal to, etc, etc..."
Maybe somewhere in the county there is a pro-bono or reduced-fee lawyer program available for those who need only limited legal services ? Call your County Public defender's office and ask if there is anyone they can refer you to. I do not believe the Public Defender can be of help, themselves, in this instance,as far as representation...but most have a list of other helpful law organizations.

Again, this way, you give the authorities some pushback, and they know they cannot just keep coming on your property and verbally boss you around without providing the proper documentation. If you can even just get ANY lawyer to give you their card (or written letter), this way should an officer come again (without serving a notice or warrant or any of that), you can just hand him/her the lawyer's card/letter and say "we have been researching applicable laws and codes....if you have no formal notices or documents to present to me, please contact my lawyer. Goodbye."

Again, they are trying to intimidate you, so keep doing what you are doing...research the codes, call pro-animal organizations, and try to get some limited legal representation.

Keep it up.

[jameswaller]

tall fences make good neighbors,./.it is shameful that we live at the mercy of bird haters,or people that find a dislike of us,.,these are the people that you cannot educate,,you have to now work within the guide lines of the city,,use your permit and persuasion with the city dept.indicated-explain the situation/sometimes they listen,..wow,.my heart goes out to you and to make room in the garage,add a room,big tent,trailor,anything to get them out of view of the so called public,,i am in the same situation if my only neighbor complains,,i hate this city(where i live) as they have never done nothing but stand in my way of anything i have had to do with them,..bring a lawsuit against your complaining neighbor/city,,this is destroying your way of life/creativity/,find out why the complaint was made,.maybe it is discrimination/talk to a lawyer( that likes birds),.my dander is up on this thread,./keep us posted,..sincerely james waller

[spirit wings]

try not to worry too much, you got us dude, follow jays advice..... Goverment is so restricting in our lives it is starting to creep me out.....stay with it.

[jang786]

16.80.060 Animal regulations.
The purpose of this section is to ensure that the raising and maintenance of animals does not create an adverse impact on adjacent properties by reason of dust, noise, visual blight, odor, fumes, bright lights, or insect infestations.

A. Pre-Existing Uses. Any legally established nonconforming animal-keeping use that became nonconforming upon adoption of this Development Code, shall be allowed to continue subject to Chapter 16.228 (Nonconforming Uses, Structures, and Parcels).

B. Existing Lots of Record. Animals may be kept on legally established lots of record, even if less than the minimum lot size referenced in Table 3-14, subject to compliance with setback regulations of the underlying zoning district and the requirements of this Development Code.

C. Uses Not Allowed. Live hogs, swine, shoats, pigs, pot-bellied pigs, roosters, cockerels, and wild animals (as defined in Section 6.08.150 of the Municipal Code) shall not be permitted within the corporate limits of the City, except as exempt under Title 6 of the Municipal Code.

D. Allowed Uses. Animal-keeping uses allowed in Division 2 (Zoning Districts, Allowable Land Uses, and Zone-Specific Standards), shall comply with the standards provided in Table 3-14, and with all other standards and requirements of this section and this Development Code and with all other applicable sections of the Municipal Code.

E. Animal-Keeping Standards. The standards in Table 3-14 shall apply to all animal-keeping uses.






“Wild animal” means any animal not ordinarily and customarily domesticated, including, but not limited to, skunk, raccoon, opossum, squirrel, or fox
it says on the website that u cant keep wild animals but my pigeons arent wild..

[jang786]

I really dont wanna give my birds away i will try to do everything as possible.. i found some breeders from stockton on the internet if they can keep pigeons and clubs around in stockton then that means ill be able to keep them too right, because when i asked the officer if i could get a permit and he told me that there is no law in this city that says u could keep pigeons and i didnt know what to say and when i told him that there are pigeon fanciers around in stockton and he said maybe their neighbors havnt compained yet. my loft was built without a permit and if they do let me keep pigeons that means ill have to build my loft again and then get a permit?

[pattersonk2002]

Originally Posted by jang786

I really dont wanna give my birds away i will try to do everything as possible.. i found some breeders from stockton on the internet if they can keep pigeons and clubs around in stockton then that means ill be able to keep them too right, because when i asked the officer if i could get a permit and he told me that there is no law in this city that says u could keep pigeons and i didnt know what to say and when i told him that there are pigeon fanciers around in stockton and he said maybe their neighbors havnt compained yet. my loft was built without a permit and if they do let me keep pigeons that means ill have to build my loft again and then get a permit?

You will need to check code on that too, where I live you can build a 10x10 without a permit

[Msfreebird]

I would follow JAYE'S advice!
They CANNOT just come on your property and take your birds without proper paperwork - I don't care who they are.
The way I read that ordinance - you are allowed to keep 10 "homing pigeons". Unless its been updated (but probably not), but I would check anyway.
I would also call those other breeders/keepers that you found in Stockton, and see if they can advise you on the ordinance's. And see how they are allowed to keep their birds. I'm sure they'd help a fellow pigeon keeper.
If it were me, I'd be ALL OVER THIS! My animals come before any sociability to my neighbors. I would also demand to know the "nature of the complaint" i.e. noise, cleanliness, what?!
Good luck

[Charis]

jang, you are doing great with research. I can't help but notice that you are 17 which may be why the officer, that came to your house feels he can bully you around. Do you have a parent or adult friend that can help you with this officer?
Your coop may be squeaky clean and make sure it stays that way. Check around to make sure rats and mice haven't taken up residence because the complaint may be because of that.

[ND Cooper]

I don't know if this will help or not, but I've always refered to my pigeons as Racing Pigeons = Non Wild + Paid for, or purchased Birds.
Maybe if you can show proof of purchase some how that you bought them, it might prove that they are non wild, and you could keep them.
Since they are now Racing Pigeons, bought and paid for, they should Not be considered as Poultry, or Wild.
Racing Pigeons are a Hobby, And a Sport! Not just wild pigeons.
I would leave the word Homing Out, when you talk about your pigeons.
Don't be intimitated, and don't get angry at the officer, he is just doing his job, that he probly doesn't like doing anyway.
Me personally, I would talk to a lawyer, because the words homing pigeons is not specific enough wording in the code.
Hope all turns out good for you, ND Cooper

[estelle2]

I Live In Cameron Park Ca. About Thirty Min. From Sacramento Ca. I Have A Outside Aviary No Birds Yet . I' Am Looking For One Pair Of Pigeons. What Typs Of Pigeons Do You Have ? Call Me I Mite Be Able To Help. 916-709-1198 Estelle2

[pattersonk2002]

Just a thought, don't tell them about the eggs untill last. You see if they hatch you will have over ten and have to start all over again. Carful, like Jaye said, don't just blurt out the whole story