Picky pigeons, and poop problems.

[judifur]

So, my pigeons i have now, Kaylee; the baby a parent gave to me, and Simon, the somewhat older guy the Vet gave to me, are picky eaters.

So far they are only eating pigeon pellets (ordered from new england pigeon supply a while back), and these somewhat larger round orange seeds. I have offered them a plethera of choices. They will pick up everything, but throw it back down. Kaylee especially will pick something up, throw it down, then look up and me as if to say "What the heck is this?! Where's my bottle?!" and then squeek at me some more.

So i've been hand feeding them 2 times a day because I worry they aren't getting enough nutrition. And Simon hasn't really figured out this whole 'eating on his own' thing, even though he's older. he's getting better though.

Is there any way to doctor up the food so they'll eat all of the wonderful things I have for them? (peas, corn, a variety of bird seed) Or are they still just too little? I keep thinking "These are pigeons! they never seem this picky when I see them in a city!"

I've lost track of how old they are. I'm not so good at keeping track of time. Kaylee isn't flying, but more like 'assisted hopping' to surfaces a 3-5 inches high, and Simon (dispite a good portions of feathers being torn from his right wing) can manage to get in the air a couple inches and skip across my floor. If he gets a good jump behind him, he can get on my kitchen bench, a good foot off the floor.

Anyone think they're still too little and will eat more when they're older?

Also, Simon's poops are -pretty- runny in comparison to Kaylee's. There's alot of water involved in his. The two birds have the same diet and Kaylee's droppings are small perfect little mounds with white caps and his are goopy with yellow (instead of the white) and lots of water.

The vet said when she gave him to me that she tested him and he was free of parasites or anything contagious to Kaylee. I want to beleive that is right, that he's fine, but his droppings just seem so goopy and watery (no strange color except the yellow.) Should I take away his formula for a day and see if the droppings firm up, like he might be just getting -alot- of water from the formula?

Or should i just take him back to the vet and ask for her to check him again? >.<

[Maggie-NC]

Hi Judifer

Your pigeons are probably still a bit too young to fully eat on their own so I would continue with the 2 x day feedings, morning and evening, but put out small seed for them. The small seed are much easier for them to pick up. Next weekend, try feeding them only at night but keep seed and water in front of them all the time. They'll catch on quickly and once they start eating well you can add larger things like peas, lentils, safflour.

Have you tried giving Simon apple cider vinegar? It really helps their digestive system. You can add a small amount to the formula each time you feed him, maybe 1 cc. Also, plain yogurt is really good to add to the formula. Either of these things can only help Simon and won't hurt Kaylee either.

[judifur]

Thank you. I've been giving a couple drops of ACV in their water. Kaylee is a good drinker. Not sure if Simon's figured it out. Just gotta get a hold of some yogurt.
peace
-judi

[warriec]

From what i read your birds are really young. How old are they

[judifur]

I think they're going on 4 weeks, well, Kaylee anyway. I donno. As I said, I lost track of time. Simon was given to me from my vet. Went in there one day with an injured starling, brought Kaylee along for an exam, the Vet asked if I wanted another. Said he wasn't picking up seeds on his own and needed hand feeding, He's a bit older than Kaylee. He's more feathered out and flying some. Simon flew 6-8 feet across my kitchen today dispite missing alot of feathers on his right wing.

Anyway, the vet thought Kaylee and Simon could be friends, and she could teach him how to pick up seeds as I taught Kaylee that already.

Note: I ordered the Kaytee way back when I had Inara (ordered a bunch of pigeon supplies.) well, i've recently run out of Kaytee, and they don't seem to like the substitution I have. (soaked pigeon pellets with small seeds and baby cereal) Is that ok?

Sometimes they like it, sometiems they don't. i'm trying not to worry much as they are eating some on their own. (And pooping, lots, lol) I watched them today, they're trying a few differnt seeds

Going back into my head through dates I'd say Kaylee is 4 weeks old, and simon is a bit older. I'll try to find a more accurate date really soon.

Thank you for your help.
-Judi

[judifur]

I found this recipe on tis website:
http://www.diamonddove.com/q&a/feedingbabydoves.html

I know i have pigeons, not doves, but, they're similar...right?

1. One half cup kitten chow (soaked in 8 oz of hot water add 4 ml of avitron or avimen vitamins)
2. one half cup Prosobee or Isomil (at use concentration)
3. one half cup Hi Protein Baby cereal dry flakes.
4. one half a teaspoon bene bac

This was the only recipe i found that i thought I could manage. I find myself wishing I was back in the states. I would know exactly where to get everything.

I was ticked that our local, tiny, commisary didn't carry plain yogurt. I would have to replace bene bac with yogurt.

Do you folks think my babies will be ok eating seeds on their own for a little while untill i get a moment to grab these ingredients. Ever since I ran out of Exact a couple days ago it's been hit or miss with the bottle feedings. They have seeds in their crops, and readily eat the pellets out of my hands, i just want to make sure they have the nutrition they need.

I'm being a crazy paranoid mom....i'm sure. lol.

Just wanna know if that recipe will be ok for a while.

-Judi

[velo99]

Judi,
If Simon is eating mostly pellets thats why his poop is runny. Just keep on going with what you are doing but give them less choices in the feeder. Feed them what they like to eat for the next few days. They are really close to eating on their own.

In a few days give them something new before you feed the familiar. If you let them they will just eat what they like. In a few weeks plan out a nice diet of four or five seeds and feed them that. Don`t feed them again till it is all gone. Rotate seeds to keep them happy and healthy and curious.

They are equatable to a 2 year old kid for most of their lives. They get it but don`t neccessarily like it. They get over it. We are the keepers, they are our charges. It is really easy to forget that.

yits

[Maggie-NC]

Judi, I don't see anything in the Diamond Dove mixture that would hurt your babies even though I don't know if I would classify a DD in the same category as a regular dove - I just don't know anything about them except they are teeny.

It is great if you have or can get Benebac. That is one of my favorite products. I don't always go by their directions - something about skipping a few days; instead, I add their measuring spoon of Benebac to the last feeding of the day, every day. We are currently hand feeding a baby mourning dove and he is doing very well on Benebac.

You didn't mention how long it will take you to get all these products to make the DD mixture. If too many days go by and they are not eating well on their own, their health may suffer. Then again, if you can spend some time with them and teach them to eat, you may not even need to feed them. If you can get access to a gram scale and weigh them every day it would help tremendously. Any time we switch a baby to self-feed they lose some weight but you just have to stay on top of it. We recently had to bring a young pigeon back in the house from the aviary because he was not eating well. We allowed him to eat in his cage for a couple of days, put him back with the big guys and he seems to be doing well.

If you do make the DD mixture, be sure to keep it refrigerated and not carry it over too many days.

[judifur]

I wil be able to drive to the grocery store tomorrow after work. While i'm there i'll check if the PX has a gram scale.

I ordered a probiotic (and other supplies) -weeks- ago from global pigeon supplies. *rolls eyes* things take forever to get here. grr...

I just attempted to bottle feed them a few min ago, they would wouldn't have any of it. Kaylee's crop had quite a few seeds in it, Simon has -some- and was pecking away at the -very- tiny seeds and making good progress with it.

i'm not going to let myself worry about them for tonight. Gotta go to sleep and work in the morning.

Thanks folks.

-Judi

[warriec]

I think your birds are going thru a weaning stage right now so they are not sure what is edible. They will soon learn how to eat. If you are worried you should try green gram or similar sized food. baby corn is good size too.

[judifur]

So here I am. It's slow at work so i'm fooling around browsing your forum when i come across a photo of a baby pij who looks kinda like my Simon. and it's a WOOD PIGEON!

*smacks head* I just thought pigeons came in all manner of colors.

He's mostly grey, with a peach/pink/orange breast. His legs are grey too. His beak is a bit longer than Kaylee's and he's got a white stripe in the middle of his wings.

I'll have to get some photos going >.<

Dear lord, they aren't even the same species!!! *heavy sigh* Why on earth would the vet give me him? Her english was Ok, not great, but well enough. She metioned she worked more with domesticaed pigeons than feral ones. Maybe she didn't have the words to explain..?

I am such a nerd...

This changes everything, doesn't it? should I separate these two, they get on well enough, cuddeling and all.

-Judi

[judifur]

Simon liked it, Kaylee didn't. *sigh* I'll see what I can do to it to tweek it. Add a few of those pigeon pellets? I donno....

Looked for a scale, didn't find one. I'll check german stores tomorrow.

-Judi