I Found A Tame Feral Pigeon, But He Seems Retarded And Confused

[xahtep]

Hello,

A couple of days ago I was exploring a derelict hospital with a friend, when we came across a quiet little street pigeon sitting on a stair. He didn't flinch when we went near him, and was quite happy for us to stroke his head and even pick him up - he perched quite happily on my friend's arm as we climbed out of the building.

At first we surmised that he was born in the hospital and had never seen a predator, so was not scared of us. But we soon found that he was a bit of a wierd bird.

He walks around in circles aimlessly, usually completely misses when pecking at seeds and can't seem to fly properly. I can hold a seed out for him and he'll peck my fingers twenty times before grabbing the seed, and then he usually drops it. He can fly out of his box and onto the floor, but not around the room. When he's not doing anything else he'll usually just stand there quite still, sometimes sleeping.

Anyway, we brought him to my flat, gave him a bath and I made him a little space out of a cardboard box - lining it with towels and newspaper. I went to the local food shop and bought a bag of mixed seeds and fruits (muesli style) and put down a bowl of them and some water.

After the first night I went to see him and the seeds and water were scattered everywhere. He'd flown out of the box and had emitted greenish-white craps all over the carpet. He was standing quite still next to the radiator, not asleep.

For the second night I made him a home in a drawer, leaving it enough ajar so he could get some air and light, but not enough so he could fly out. I figured that he wasn't actually feeding so force fed him a few seeds and fruits. It was difficult at first, but he soon got used to it and even seemed to relish the food that was being gently pressed to the back of his mouth. I also dipped his head in the water bowl but he didn't seem to drink, so I soaked a few seeds in water and fed him those as extra.

He's a lovely little bird with a surprisingly chilled out temperament, but I'm concerned as to why he's acting so wierd with the unpeckable seed and the odd circular walking and the lack of flying. Can anyone please give some advice on what I should do next? Am I looking after him properly? This is the first time I've ever handled a pigeon so I'm a bit clueless.

Some pictures of Mr Miyagi below ...



[with my friend who discovered him]



[in his new drawer-home]



[me stroking his head, not long after his first bath]

[AZWhitefeather]

Welcome to Pigeon Talk.

It sounds like your little rescue may possibly have PMV.
The following link will take you to some very valuable information regarding this illness.
http://www.pigeon-aid.pigeon.net/pmv.htm

Please keep us posted on how things are coming along & by all means if you have any other questions, don't hesitate to post them.

Cindy

He also looks like a youngster.

[Cricket]

He looks young to me. Use your finger as if it were a beak and stick it in the bowl of seed. He may just be learning and needs some more practice. No others were around?

[xahtep]

Thanks for your advice, both of you!

That photo of the bird on the PMV page, he was doing that with his head too, twisting it up. And tossing seed backwards when I put it in his mouth. I'm sad to see that it's probably that disease. What's the chances of him pulling through, do you think? I work during the day and there's no-one else in the flat, so if I only feed and water him in the morning and evening, and take him out of his box in the evening for some company, will that be okay?

Either way I'm sure it's got to be better than the derelict building he was stuck in. Damp, dusty, slimy and probably a lack of food too - I've no idea what he ate in there. We didn't spot any other pigeons, but I'll probably head back there some night for a further look. The only entrance to the building that I can see he could have got through was a broken skylight three storeys above where we found him. Maybe he fell and couldn't get back out.

I'll try the technique with tapping the seed. Even though he could be ill, he still seems to be learning things. Like at first, he didn't want to grab any seed off me, completely ignoring it - but after putting it in his mouth manually, he started trying to take it when I held it near to him.

[pdpbison]

Hi xahtep,




He is of an age where he has not learned to eat or drink on his own yet...where, his mom and dad would have been feeding and watering him, unless somehow things got goofed up with that, or they got seperared...and he might have beenin effect, 'orphaned' when you found him.



For him to drink by having his Beak guided to it, the Water needs to be 'tepid'...and, often,they require one keep one's finger tips literally on the sides of their Beak while they drink ( since, being as they eat and drink out of their parent's Throats, they are used to 'feeling' their Parent's Beak being around theirs when eating or drinking...)


He will likely eat gladly by 'gobbling' if you were to work with him via this -


http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/f5/sho...ons-29629.html


...even though yours is of course around fledgling age...


Use very small whole Seeds, such as Finch Seed or Canary Seed...



Let us know what the poops and urates are looking like? Even post some images of them?



Best wishes!


Phil
l v

[pdpbison]

Originally Posted by xahtep

Thanks for your advice, both of you!

That photo of the bird on the PMV page, he was doing that with his head too, twisting it up. And tossing seed backwards when I put it in his mouth. I'm sad to see that it's probably that disease. What's the chances of him pulling through, do you think? I work during the day and there's no-one else in the flat, so if I only feed and water him in the morning and evening, and take him out of his box in the evening for some company, will that be okay?

Either way I'm sure it's got to be better than the derelict building he was stuck in. Damp, dusty, slimy and probably a lack of food too - I've no idea what he ate in there. We didn't spot any other pigeons, but I'll probably head back there some night for a further look. The only entrance to the building that I can see he could have got through was a broken skylight three storeys above where we found him. Maybe he fell and couldn't get back out.

I'll try the technique with tapping the seed. Even though he could be ill, he still seems to be learning things. Like at first, he didn't want to grab any seed off me, completely ignoring it - but after putting it in his mouth manually, he started trying to take it when I held it near to him.

PPMV is possible of course...but, time will tell...

I did notice in the image of him on your shoulder, that his head was being held oddly.


He might have Canker...which can cause some odd 'Head' and neck movements...if you can have someone hold him vertically, under a strong light, open his Beak and look into his Throat and see if everyhting is 'pink' and healthy looking, or, if you see any grey or off white or yellow things...



Let us know on the poops...


Phil
l v

[tms1950]

I wonder if it`s possible this bird is blind? I`ve had very young songbirds come into my rehab that held their heads at odd angles,didn`t want to perch(even though they were old enough),couldn`t find their food or water (so I crop-fed),and either stood stark still or walked in circles.Further investigation into their eyesight by the vet revealed they were totally blind.When they are holding their heads at odd angles,they are depending on their hearing.Just a thought.
Teresa

[TAWhatley]

Good point, Teresa! My blind birds do definitely "circle" and tilt their heads in order to better use their sense of hearing and perhaps some sense that we don't know exists.

Terry

[tms1950]

Well,that would explain why it misses when it pecks at seed,doesn`t fly and stands perfectly still when it isn`t walking in circles.If it was found in that old building,abandoned,the parents may have left him behind when they realized he couldn`t fly or find his way out of there.My little blind ones were well-fed,but had just fledged & jumped out of their nests.There they were found by humans.A flashlight shined in their eyes showed no pupil reaction when I took each to the vet.
He will need to adapt the bird`s environment.

[Pidgey]

Unie does a lot of that but she wouldn't even attempt to peck at a seed held out in front of her. I've got another that's apparently somewhat blind--he seems to be able to see what's within a few inches of him so he can find his food bowl in the cage by sight. Put him out in the loft, though, and you can tell that he's not seeing everything. He also flies more like Unie. He doesn't listen for sounds as attentively as Unie does, either. His pupils do respond to light, though, so the test doesn't work with him to demonstrate partial blindness. Mr. Miyagi's more than likely too young to know how to peck at food, though. Newcastle on Tyne?

Pidgey

[Larry_Cologne]

There's always a possibility that he may have two or more things wrong with him at the same time. If he exhibits symptoms which seem to point towards one condition (disease, handicap, or injury), but another symptom seems to contradict this, it may be overlapping symptoms for two different things. Don't let a diagnosis of one thing rule out the presence of another.

I took a baby pigeon (wings were shorter than those of your pigeon, tips didn't quite reach tail feathers). Couldn't use legs, seemed to have no feeling in them. Gave him cotrim (or whatever I had available), treated him for paratyhpoid. Wieteke recovered nicely. Two years later, found baby pigeon Luxie-311 in same spot, probably a sibling, couldn't use legs much, didn't use tail. Fed him. His legs didn't seem all that bad so decided to get advice of vet I knew. Vet thought it was a nutritional problem, said that feather-growing is an energy-intensive process. Didn't give Luxie any meds. He recovered use of his legs, but never was able to use his tail. As a male, he was unable to drag his tail when roo-cooing the females, and I think he was caught by a hawk or falcon a few months ago, before he was even a year old, because he couldn't maneuver quickly enough to take the necessary evasive action. So, it might be that nutritional deficiency (if that were the case) may have contributed to the onset of something else.

Larry

[cyro51]

Hi xahtep,

We have a lot of PPMV in the UK at the moment, more than ever before and although your pigeon is very young all the symptoms that he shows are typical of PPMV. I don't think there is any doubt that this is what his problem is. He would not try to pick up seed if he were blind or too young to feed himself.

He will have to be kept apart from other pigeons for at least 4 weeks, but he is likely to make a good recovery. However, he could have a relapse up to a year after recovery.

John_D has two young ones with PPMV in his care at the moment and they are thriving on a diet of thawed frozen maize and peas, small peanuts (the sort for human consumtion, and bits of pigeon mix fed to them by hand. They have a narrow water dish available to them at all times and a deep dish of seed. The fact that the seed is spilt is a good sign because it means he is trying to eat and is probably managing to swallow a few seeds too.

If you PM me your address then I can send you some probiotics which will help balance his gut flora, although PPMV will affect the digestion and cause diarrhea or hard worm shaped poops in a pool of water.

Cynthia

[xahtep]

Thanks again everyone for your advice and comments, it's much appreciated.

Mr Miyagi seems to have improved a little bit over the last few days, or at least got more comfortable with his new surroundings. As soon as I come near him he starts chirping and nibbling my fingers when I hold them near him, whereas before he'd be rather quieter. He enjoys perching, and can stand for ages on one leg in that way, often sleeping.

He still walks around in circles aimlessly, twitches his head backwards and has trouble with the seed. I haven't seen any other symptoms of the PPMV though.

Having said that, he's got a little bit better at locating the seed when I hold it near him, and even chases it if I put him on the ground and move the seed away while he's trying to grab it. However, he still pecks wildly and rather inaccurately, and tends to grasp it in his beak and throw it away by mistake. If I hold it to him then put it on the ground, he'll peck the ground a bit then resume pecking at my fingers. I don't know how that reflects on the possibility he may be blind.

I made a short video a couple of days back which demonstrates some of this (it was for my friend who also found him, but it shows a typical feeding session.) He's eating pine nuts; since then I've bought some wild bird seed packs to give him a more comprehensive diet. Here it is, http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...36681485&hl=en

I've rearranged his living quarters a bit to make them larger, taking the top two drawers out of the chest of drawers and putting him in the bottom one, and constructing a perch out of corrugated cardboard. To my surprise, he managed to fly out of there a couple of times, for two metres or so. He could hardly fly at all when we first found him. He then wanders randomly around the front room, pecking away at interesting things like the carpet and sofa.

Regarding his faeces, they're a mix of white and green. Here's a photo of one of his larger ones from a few days back:



They're a lot whiter now, around 70% white 30% green.

I looked down his throat and it seems nice and pink, no signs of anything weird-looking.

Pidgey, yes Newcastle upon Tyne. The hospital we found him in is an old Victorian-era one in the city.

Cynthia, thanks for your kind offer! I'll PM you after this.

[pdpbison]

Hi xahtep,




Glad to hear ( and 'see' ) he is doing so well..!


He is definitely a lovely little youngster, and one who enjoyed his social and feed times..!


He looks very happy.



Now, one way to work with his self-feeding, would be to have him on a Towel on your lap, so he is standing, and, in front of him, have a small Seed Bowl, even elevating it so it is more like chest high to him...and, with one hand, 'cup' your Hand over his Head so he is limited in his head-movement to only be able to peck and raise up within a span of two or two and a half inches...and, in working with him this way, or in variations of this, you solve or reduce anyway, the extraneous motions he might otherwise be having in pecking.


For 'PPMV', his symptoms appear quite mild, and quite possibly they will go away entirely, or close to entirely, over some months...time will tell.


You might do well to consider some Vitamines and Minerals also, the "B" Vitamines particularly, and the "D" also...for him...along with Calcium-Magnesium and other.


Regular people Vitamines and Mineral Capsules, can be used easily, by portioning out only a little of course, and adding it to either his Water, or, to his Seeds, and if to his Seeds then one would very lightly 'glisten' the Seeds with some fresh Olive Oil for the powder to adhere, so it gets eaten along with the Seed it is adhering to...even adding some Grit to this also so he for sure gets some of that also.

Or, by obtaining Avian type suppliments...of course.


Have fun..!




Phil
l v

[xahtep]

Some not-so-good news on Mr Miyagi: I decided to take him down to a nearly field so he could have a walk about outdoors and get some fresh air. Unfortunately, as I walked into the field something must have spooked him as he immediately flew off my arm in a panic (I had him perched on my forearm held near to my chest, with the other hand sort of cupping him) before I had time to stop him. Not being able to fly very well, he crashed to the ground awkwardly, landing on his right-hand side. When I picked him up he flapped his wings, but only his left one moved normally, the right one just twitched a bit.

He's been like this for two days now, unable to use his right wing correctly, and is a lot more subdued and quiet than usual; he's doesn't seem very happy at all. I've tried feeling both his wings to see if there was any difference but I couldn't tell. Not sure what to do now.