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#62
6th July 2008, 12:48 PM
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3 centimetres? That is quite deep! Isn’t there something that can put in that wound and then wash it after a while that will kill microbes that might be lurking in there and stop the healing of the wound. Just a thought.
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#63
6th July 2008, 12:56 PM
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Quote:
I am not the only one that has used it successfully. From Avian Wound Management: The wounds, including a puncture wound over the lower back, were packed with a hydrogel and dressed with a thin hydrocolloid dressing. From the chapter on "The treatment of wounds" , Practical Wildlife Care by Les Stocker: The aim of all wound dressings is to keep the wound in a moist condition so that any necrotic material can be easily removed either by the body's natural process or by further sessions of lavage. ..the types of suitable dressing for this debridement phase are: Hydrogels Intrasite Gel (Smith & Nephew - a convenient hydrogel in a re-sealable tube)... These primary dressings will cover and keep the wound moist to aid debridement. They should be changed daily or every second day and will clean the wound without damaging healthy tissue. A propos of nothing that has been said here, Les Stocker has also something interesting to say about the application of topical antibiotics and some other wound management practices: " Much is written about adding antibiotics directly to the wound. Generally topical antibiotics may be effective during the first few hours but after that their use is pointless. Targeted systematic antibiotics are the only treatment that will be effective...there are some practices which are contraindicated in wound management. Powders of any sort should not be used in wounds except where maggots are present in large animals. Antiseptics and disinfectants, unless proven, cant be cytoxic to healthy cells in a wound. Povidine-iodine for cleaning is ineffective as it is de-activated by any debris. Wounds should not be mechanically scrubbed with swabs or cotton wool." Cynthia
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All beings are fond of themselves, they like pleasure, they hate pain, they shun destruction, they like life and want to live long. To all, life is dear; hence their life should be protected. -Mahavira Last edited by cyro51; 6th July 2008 at 01:00 PM.
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#64
6th July 2008, 01:57 PM
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Hi,
Just to confirm what Cynthia thought, it is Intracite Gel I've been using, sorry I should have put it in full. It seems the wound stayed moist all the time I was using the gel, this hard matter appeared to form once I left it to hopefully heal. I've just been bathing it with warm saline and picking out a bit more necrotic, but it is bleeding slightly so I've sprayed it with silver and put some more gel in, will leave it alone again for a couple of days. He's had a drop of Metacam too. Christina, If anyone knows of anything like that I'd think it would be ideal. I just can't see what's at the end, or even where it is. I may have to try and see the vet he saw before and ask him if he'll have a look. Not got much faith in him though as when he looked before with his magnifier and light, he told me that he didn't think there was any more necrotic in there. Two days later I got some more out. Ooh, I don't like this, it was all going so well.
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#65
6th July 2008, 02:16 PM
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I'd used mine in either Pierpont or DD, can't remember which. In the healing process, they'd both developed pockets, where there was a hole about 1/4" big with a space inside that you could have stuffed a small grape, were the hole big enough. I pumped the stuff in there and eventually had to work it out as a very hardened piece like dried model airplane glue. Apparently, if the lining of a pocket wound is sealed off so that it's not constantly creating moisture, that stuff just might dry down. I expect it's like silica gel and will absorb water. If there isn't enough available locally, then perhaps it dries down like what I ended up with. And if the opening to the pocket heals down pretty small, you can really end up with a rough time getting it back out. I want to say that the stuff I used was DuoDERM Hydrocolloid Gel. Is that the same stuff?
Pidgey
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#66
6th July 2008, 04:19 PM
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The Intracite I get is from a pharmacy, that's what it's called here. Comes in a sterile white cone. I notice just after I've put it in the wound it seems to almost disappear, seems to stay moist with the warmth of the body.
I've just been reading about Hydrocolloid, and obviously it is used for debridement aswell but it isn't the same product as Intracite. I notice it states that it's waterproof, maybe a thicker consistency. Don't know to be honest if the formula is the same. It'll be interesting to see if this hardens up again in the wound if I don't bathe it for a couple of days.
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#67
14th July 2008, 03:04 PM
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I have been keeping an eye on this wound for the last few days and not actually doing anything with it as it just doesn't seem to be healing up totally inside. I thought maybe I was stopping it by keep bathing it.
Pidgey I do wonder if the gel was what was going hard inside the pocket after all as I haven't used it for a few days and it hasn't got this hard stuff in any more. I have just been putting Manuka Honey on it. I think this is now like the wound you described before in the last but one post about Pierpont or DD. You said if the lining of the wound is sealed off it might not be producing moisture, and that is what I think is going on here. All the way through the initial days of bathing the wound the gel was no problem as I was still getting necrotic matter out. I do wonder if there is something still in there stopping it healing but I can't see and I just can't put him through anymore intrusive debriding as I don't get any more black necrotic out now. Is there any way to at least get the outside to heal together, at the moment basically there is still a small hole in his side. The slit in the skin is small but it opens up into a small pocket inside. If the edge of the inside has hardened off is this ever likely to fill in as I imagine it needs to be rough skin to knit together now, if you get my drift! If not I apologise!  Janet
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#68
14th July 2008, 03:23 PM
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Well, it might never heal closed if there's something still in there that the body can't push out. It's kind of a bad place, too, seeing as how that's where the working muscles are for the downstroke. That's why I use an otoscope for those kinds of things--to see what's going on deep in those kinds of wounds. I hate 'em when they get that deep and almost closed off! You're a lot better off to keep them cleaned out at the bottom so that they'll heal up more and more shallow.
Pidgey
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#69
18th July 2008, 01:48 PM
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Charlie really got me worried today. I have been leaving the hole alone for a few days to see what came of it naturally as he was getting very agitated by me trying to clean it out every day.
I had treated him with Feather Drop just as a precaution against mites etc yesterday. Today when I went down to see him he was very wet. Initially I was pleased as he'd had a bath, the first one I've seen him take. The only trouble he was acting very strangely. He kept running up and down his ramp and perches sideways. He kept falling backwards off his perch aswell, stretching out his wings to balance but not managing to keep up. He was very frightened and didn't try to get away when I picked him up, even snuggled into my hand and stayed there for ages panting. He was holding the wing up slightly that the wound is under and lifting his leg up higher than normal as he walked. I took him inside and had a look at the wound, got some more scabby bits out of it, again he didn't even try and get away like normal. I kept him in a smaller cage for a few hours to settle down. He's back outside now with Danni and seems to be ok now he's dried out. I have no idea what caused him to act like that, it was if he was trying to get away from his wound or something by walking backwards. Maybe just frightened of being wet, I just don't know. I'm just glad he's settled down again poor soul.
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#74
18th July 2008, 02:30 PM
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I never did like the look of that hole...
My biggest worry has always been that there's something worse under there somewhere that might rise up someday to cause an infection. I suppose that it's possible to get some miserable creepy, crawly bug in there that could itch real bad or worse. You wouldn't happen to have some medicine that can systemically treat blood-sucking insects, do you? Of course, they can always get something unrelated. Pidgey
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#75
18th July 2008, 02:46 PM
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Gosh, I hadn't thought of that. I'll have to do some searching for a product like that.
Better try the vet again, even if I can only get him to see what's at the bottom of this hole somehow. They won't do much else. I tried with my magnifier again today but it's too dark and goes in too far. Better get back to the flushing out daily for the time being. The stuff I put on him is systemic now I think about it, that's for mites and such infestations. Could try garlic in his water too to put them off. Last edited by amyable; 18th July 2008 at 02:49 PM.
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