more questions

[badger]

Thanks, everybody. Predictably, I have more questions, now that my visitor has been around for a few days.

He is housed in a large plastic cat carrier on a 3rd floor balcony with sun during the day, and a metal mesh door that he can see out of. If it gets a bit cool at night (we're down to single digits some nights), I put in a large well-wrapped can full of boiling water, his own little furnace. He loves his basket, which I have filled with newspaper strips. He spends every night and part of the day in there.

Although there is seed (in a cup and sprinkled around) and water in the crate, I bring him out every two or three hours to 'fill his crop', since he is having no luck feeding himself, although I'm pretty sure he is drinking. Is it OK if I am still giving him the salt-sugar combination in his water? He picks up seeds but seems incapable of ferrying them into his gullet. Twice a day*he gets thawed green peas and the rest of the time ground-up pigeon mix and a little water. He really hates having his beak pried open and can't seem to handle any of the gadgets you have suggested - a spoon with the sides bent in, etc. I think he probably gets about a tablespoon of food each feeding. Is this enough? Is there anything else I cam tempt him with?

After his feeding, he is allowed to stroll around a little. He is definitely trying out his wings but not making any effort to fly. He's beginning to look sleeker, the pin feathers have almost disappeared and he has lots of new feathers coming in along his sides

Mainly I just need tips on the food. Will he just suddenly figure it out how to feed himself or is it gradual?

I'll try to get another pic...

[Reti]

That's a really nice set up you have there for the little guy. No wonder he likes his new home.
I think, since he is getting food and water, you can stop the sugar. Plain water is good for him. You can add vitamins in it. You'll find them in the pet store, I hope.
At that age he should start eating by himself, little by little.
Are you giving him small seeds? All my babies loved to peck on millet. Then gradually he will start eating the bigger ones also.

Would love to see some picks. Sounds like a handsome and sweet baby.

Reti

[bigbird]

At this age, your bird can eat soaked pigeon food, feed by hand, one or two grains at a time. This kind of food will digest quickly but you must feed often.
I usually soak about one pound of seed, then keep it in the frig. until time to feed. I then place a portion into some warm water, and drain. As I feed, each pinch of seed is dipped into warm water before feeding.

If you let the bird become very hungry, then feed him the wet seed, but stop at intervals to show him how to eat by placing one or two seeds in front of him, then pecking at the seeds with your finger. Using this method every time you feed will teach your bird to self-feed in a short period of time.

Keep up the good work,
Regards,
Carl

[badger]

Thanks for all your suggestions. I have tried to apply some of them but his behavior is really not following the norm (as I understand it so far). He is still not truly eating on his own, although occasionally he will seize a millet seed or two and then stops. When I go to pick him up and, inevitably, feed him, he has adopted this strange behaviour, pecking and pecking at my hands, particularly between the fingers. If I put food anywhere in or on my hand, he fiddles with it for a split second and then goes back to agitating and peeping. So he might be getting 1/4 tsp. food by pecking and the rest still by 'force' feeding.

I'll look for your answers.

[cyro51]

Two of the pigeons that I found as squeakers enjoy putting thei beaks between my fingers like you describe.

It sounds as if he recognises your hand as the mouth that feeds him. Perhaps you could try the syringe and balloon method of feeding again, but guide his beak to the split by putting it between your fingers, so that the food is where he seems to think that he will find it.

Cynthia

[badger]

Me again. I need to give my visitor a name - Gilbert, say, pronounced JEEL-BAAYRE, since I am in Quebec. He seems to be growing by leaps and bounds, a few more feathers to come, but he is definitely looking more like an adult.

I am still feeding him, although less often, since someone suggested that if he was hungry enough, he'd pick up those damn seeds. Happily, he's drinking, but I can't see that he's eating much, and when I open the cage he rushes up, cheeping wildly and pecking at my hands as if he was starving to death. It's possible that I've started to imprint on him, so I now feed him in the cage, to avoid handling him too much. Does anyone think this is cruel? He does like sitting in my lap; shuts right up.

Lots of wing action. I was wondering if development might be a kind of cluster, where the different functions stimulate each other. In other words, if he was practising his flying, the self-feeding would be accelerated. Just a thought.

Here are the pics

[cyro51]

Hello,

There is nothing more endearing than a young pigeon!

Sometimes "only pigeons" take longer to become self feeding because they have no one to copy and no one to compete for food with. They all get there in the end, but it takes time and patience.

It might be a good idea to weigh him regularly to keep track of whether he is gaining, losing or just keeping steady.

Cynthia

[badger]

Just to update you on Gilbert. He's eating quite a bit of the millet, picks up other seeds but can't get them up into his mouth. So I am still feeding him 3-4 times a day, green peas and soaked seed. He's drinking.
He spends his nights (and days) in his crate on the balcony. I wrap it up in old blankets to make it a bit more cosy, and on occasion provide him with a little 'furnace' (see earlier post). But the temps are beginning to drop here - about 14-18 C during the day and sometimes 4-5 C at night.
If it is a coldish day or there is no sun, I bring him inside for his waterproofing shower from a spray bottle and he sits on my kitchen table quite happily or I put him on top of the door. If I 'throw' him, he flies short distances but is still not very confident. If I put him on top of the door, he stays there.
His droppings are light brown to khaki, not watery.
I guess I'm a little concerned about releasing him with winter fast approaching. I have no way of keeping him inside until April/May, no room where he could have some freedom. And two very interested - but as yet non-threatening - cats.
There is a bird shelter near Montreal. I may be able to place him there, although I think they devote most of their time to more 'exotic' varieties.
Does anyone have any ideas? If he is released just ahead of the snow into a flock with which he is certainly familiar, will he have what it takes?
I welcome your suggestions!

[fred128]

I just want to point one item out. Over many threads, it's been suggested that a homemade electrolytic solution can be made by mixing salt and sugar in water. In fact, that is a very dangerous mixture. Yeast cells always inhabit the digestive system and they adore refined sugar. Feeding this solution can cause a rise in the level of yeast cells to the point where it can be called a yeast infection (candida). It's best to buy an electrolytic solution rather than creating a homemade remedy. A yeast infection can cause a lot of symptoms including feather plucking (self-mutilation) and it doesn't develop overnight. If people claim success with this, they got away very lucky.

[maryco]

Thanks for pointing that out Fred, about the homemade rehydration fluid.

I have mixed up my own and used it twice I think, though I heard that using real brown sugar is better than white (NOT the regular brown sugar you can find in the stores, this is very fake. The real kind is harder to find but I have some Organic unrefined dark sugar)
Maybe that is why the pigeons seemed to be fine when I used the mixture.

Just though I should mention that because if it is dangerous to mix up your own then best to avoid it and I can't say much about using the normal sugar because I haven't used it.

[fred128]

Mary,
I suppose you could make a generalization that if it is not refined sugar, it's good to use. An electrolytic solution is one which contains carbohydrates and salts. The sugars that are safe are the carbohydrate portion. The salt is not only sodium based but also potassium based and that would mean that simple salt and sugar is not that great a solution.

[cyro51]

The International Rehydrating Solution is just that...a rehydrating solution recommended internationally by avian rescue organisations which includes the RSPB Wildlife Hospital. It is recommended as an alternative to plain water, that can do more harm that good.

I am certain that they know what they are talking about and would not recommend something that is dangerous to pigeons.

But is is always a good idea to check recommendations found on any notice board against various sources rather than to take one person's advice which can be flawed...however experienced in rehab that person claims to be.

Cynthia

[John_D]

I believe the main thing going for the rehydration solution - whether or not there may be better things - is that is made quickly from generally available ingredients.

If one finds a pigeon which may need hydration and a bit of a jump start, it is likely to need it asap - so it is an immediate but also a temporary measure. Whilst some of us will doubtless have electrolytes in stock, a brand new rescuer is unlikely to and may not have ready access to a bird-friendly vet or suitable store.

John

[Yong]

Hi there, I enjoyed reading your post. Sounds like you've made a pretty good friend. sure you want to part with him? Many people keep their pigeons in their home with them. I have a couple of part timers in my home. You can always adopt him out, there might be someone in Canada who would be willing to take him, or if you are able to ship outside of canada, you can ship him to the states. I don't know how canada pigeons cope with the cold, I assume that they grow lots of down to compensate for it. This will be a question to be answered by cold weather members. I'm in Florida, I'll melt before I freeze. Good luck, Yong

[badger]

Hooray hooray. I have found a temporary aviary in the country for Gilbert and he is even going to have a pigeon companion! When he is eating and flying well, he will be released in an area where there are feeders, to ease the transition. The woman I spoke to said that his feeding and flying skills would improve more quickly with another pigeon around, something I wasn't able to provide.
I am so relieved.
Thanks for all your help.