neck twisting

[Sarahttt]

Hey
Ok, this pigeon that I found is twisting his head completely around, I saw pictures from Amyable, that she is dealing with a similar situation, so maybe she can reply to this as well. Anyway, I was feeding him today, and I started feeling around his neck and I think there is a big bump on the right side of his neck! I'm freaking out here. I've talked to some of you about PMV, but here are his symptoms: poo is healthy consistency and colour, but a bit smelly (although I don't know what healthy pigeon poo smells like), his eyes are clear, and there are no sores on his wings, as I've heard some cases of PMV having. He really seems to be fine, except he twists his head completely around-no jerking, just the inability to hold his head up. He lays on his side in his cage because his neck is so twisted that he can't stand up. Three times a day I hold his head so he can eat and drink, which he does plenty of. Is there anything I can do? I'm willing to keep him for several months or longer to see how he improves, but is it possible that there could be a broken bone? Amyable- can you feel anything like that on your pigeon? I didn't think it was possible, since if his neck was broken, he would have died right? But now I don't know... Please help-this is really disturbing.

[Pidgey]

Is there any way that you can take and post a picture of this bird?

Also, you can go here:

http://people.eku.edu/ritchisong/skeleton.html

...and study the skeletal drawings to see if you can figure out the business with the lump (which may be the forward curvature of the cervical vertebrae of the neck) and further describe where it is.

Just out of curiosity, does he does move his legs and wings a little?

Pidgey

[Sarahttt]

He can move his legs and wings. He tries to flap his wings when he is upset. But he doesn't move much becauseof his neck. I'll post some pics if I can, but if you see the pics that Amyable has up, he looks just like that.

[Sarahttt]

you know, it does kinda feel like it is the curvature of the cervical vertebrae. It is very curved, and feels like it cannot be uncurved. Its hard to explain, but I very gently tried to push on the bump or bone or whatever, and it felt like it couldn't move... Does this mean anything?

[Pidgey]

Well, on the one hand, it's very unlikely that he has a broken neck if he can move his legs and wings--think about it.

You might be able to tell if that's his cervical vertebrae by feeling it at the same time as you cradle his head between your fingers and pull it upward to extend it.

Pidgey

[Pidgey]

Originally Posted by Sarahttt

his eyes are clear, and there are no sores on his wings, as I've heard some cases of PMV having.

Well, here's where it can get a little fun: the differences between Salmonellosis (commonly called "Paratyphoid"), which is a bacterial infection and PMV, which is a virus. Sores and boils (that often don't pop) on the wing usually point to Paratyphoid. The biggest symptom that you seem to be describing is called "torticollis", or the twisting of the neck. That's a symptom of both PMV and some strains of Paratyphoid that we don't see that much of, actually.

I think Reti had a bird that went through PMV where the bird was pretty twisted up most of the time for almost two weeks. There was a picture that I seem to remember and I'll go see if I can find that one.

Pidgey

[Pidgey]

Here's that thread:

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showthread.php?p=118442

...and here's a larger version of one of the pictures in question:

http://community.webshots.com/photo/...73664377ufZRlI

Pidgey

[Sarahttt]

Thanks for all your help. My bird is doing better today. He seems stronger. I've read alot about salt and sugar water. Should that only be given at the beginning? Or all throughout the bird's recovery?

[amyable]

Hi Sarahttt, Thanks for your message, yes I think it does sound very similar to your pigeons problem.

I don't seem to have any lumps on her neck though.
The main thing I really think helps her is to drink as much as possible. I gave her salt and sugar in her water and now have started putting in Apple Cider Vinegar. She doesn't seem to drink as eagerly since I've put that in, maybe the smell puts her off! She does drink eagerly now when I hold a small syringe at the side of her beak and she sips it down that way.

She is quite a bit weaker in her left side, and can't get up by herself once she falls over. Also if I hold her up, she only walks backwards. Does your little one tremble and shake?

I am very lucky and Cynthia has sent me some medication as we can't get a lot of things in the uk without prescriptions from the vets. If I took her to my vets they wouldn't help her, so this is why I'm able to help her thank goodness.

I do wish you all the luck in the world with your pigeon, and will be glad to compare notes any time.

Janet

[Trees Gray]

Originally Posted by Sarahttt

Thanks for all your help. My bird is doing better today. He seems stronger. I've read alot about salt and sugar water. Should that only be given at the beginning? Or all throughout the bird's recovery?

Yes, the hydration fluid is used after the rescued bird has been warmed up.

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showthread.php?t=8822

[Sarahttt]

Hey Janet
Yes it is exactly the same as you described: bad left side, not able to stand, walking backwards. Yesterday I put water in an egg cup, and my bird dunked his head in and in about 30 seconds, downed the whole thing! He does shake when he is scared, but he always settles down after a few minutes. Whenever he starts eating he relaxes too. If I prop him up and hold a bowl ful of seeds in front of him he eats alot. So the Baytril is for PMV right?

[Pidgey]

Baytril is for certain bacterial infections. PMV is a virus for which there is no medication. One researcher has stated that antibiotics should not be given to PMV patients if at all possible because they may exacerbate the lesions (in the brain) and, therefore, the course of and recovery from the disease. So, we only treat PMV birds with antibiotics when there is enough reason to suspect a concurrent bacterial infection that warrants it.

Pidgey

[Feefo]

Hi Sarah,

Janet is giving her pigeon Baytril because the symptoms initially suggested either e-coli or paratyphoid. From your description it sounds as if your pigeon has PMV and as Pidgey mentioned giving antibiotics can aggravate the course of the disease so we avoid it unless the symptoms suggest there is also a bacterial infection.

Pigeons with PMV often need to drink a lot, so make certain that he either has access to water without the water causing a hazard for him (I use a deep narrow pot only half full of water) or that you are able to offer him a drink frequently.

Cynthia

[Sarahttt]

Ok, thanks-no meds, lots of water. got it.