self destructing.

[Naturesgift]

I am at a loss as to what I should do with that pigeon that I got after it was hit by a car. He ripped part of his injured wing off. and he ripped into his injured crop and it is not retaining his food anymore. Is there anything I can do? or at this point is there no point?

Mandie

[Charis]

Mandie...A vet that is experienced in treating birds could sew up the crop depending upon the extent of the injury. If part of the wing is ripped off, this bird will be non releasable and need to become a permanent resident in someone's home or loft.
Do you have a vet in your area that treats birds? Can I help you find one?

[Pidgey]

Since they don't feel much by way of pain in the crop, that's an easy thing for them to do although you don't see it very often. I'm a'thinkin' that itching is probably the sensation most likely to cause that. Can you post a picture of the bird?

Pidgey

[Naturesgift]

It is this pigeon

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/f45/hit-by-car-32225.html

Its only half the crop. And I am unsure as to the extent of the damage, It will be hard to tell unless I rip the hunk of danging crop off.

I had a pigeon that had his Crop ripped open by a rat and I stitched it up and the lil man did wonderfully.

Should I remove the dangling piece?

Charis he was already determined unreleasable by a vet. and He basically said there was nothing that could be done but wrapping the wing. and he already didnt like the looks of his crop. plus he was going on about the legalness of him "working" on a pigeon.

Pidgey I wondered about it being Itchy as well.
I will work on pics.

Mandie

[Naturesgift]

here are some pics. And just when i he started eating on his own.

[Charis]

Makes me sick.
I WOULDN'T rip off the hanging piece of crop!!! With as little left as is, I don't think you should be stiching it up either.
Take the bird back to the vet.

[TAWhatley]

Charis, Mandie, and all ..

I think it is over for this pigeon.

Mandie, personally, I don't think that can be fixed, and it's time to have this bird put to sleep. I know I will get a lot of comments about this tomorrow, but that's my opinion, and it is not one I give lightly.

There is a SLIGHT possibility that all that "gunk" could be gotten out and the crop stitched, but I'm guessing there aren't any stitchable edges any longer. I'd say to take the bird back to the vet and see if something can be done, but unless you've got a really savvy vet that can pull off a miracle, it won't be happening. I am very, very sorry.

Terry

[Jaye]

TA may well be right. But in the very least...IF this bird has ANY chance, it is not via any sort of home remedy.

Mandie...this pidge MUST be taken to an avian vet ASAP. This injury is so extensive that it cannot possibly bet treated by a non-pro.

The vet will decide whether this poor guy has a chance a or not. It is not a decision which should be made by a non-vet.

This is terribly sad, and I thank you for helping give this guy at least a chance....but please get it to a vet first thing in the AM. If the vet you mentioned was saying the sorta stuff you mentioned and will not give his best effort, find another avian vet somewhere.

There are good intentions galore on this forum, and some knowledgeable folks, but this is a critical situation and beyond what advice folks can give here.

In the meantime, if you have any avian-strength painkillers, proper dilutions (I dunno, Ibuprophen, medacam, etc.) give some to the bird so he can get thru the next 12 hours.

[Pidgey]

Well, we're looking at a bird that you've had since just after Christmas, so a tad over two weeks. Frankly, it doesn't look like you'd think that any food could have gotten through that mess at all and although pictures can be deceiving sometimes, it's hard to imagine this one being so. If you've gotten solids in the poops in the last couple of weeks, though, one would have to assume that there's still something left in there. There was obviously a rupture of the crop that you could see bad stuff even in the picture from the 27th of December if you knew what you were looking at.

What a vet would normally do is clean out all that garbage until you could physically see pink flesh like that inside your mouth. Oh, there's definitely going to be some flesh that's orange or yellow-colored due to surrounding inflammation. One isn't going to know the real story until that's uncovered. So, the big question is whether or not there was still a path through or behind all that mess that was still allowing food and water to make it down to the digestive tract. If so, then where there's life there's hope. If not, then the prognosis certainly doesn't look good.

Pidgey

[Maggie-NC]

Mandie, just wondering if you could give us an update?

[Naturesgift]

sorry I havent been back on. With this lovely cold weather I got sick. and have just been popping online in short spurts. But I am feeling better this evening.

I know you all may not approve. (judging from your previous replies)

But I called my mentor and she told me to go by my gut feelings and do what I thought was right. Having just spent $80 at the vet just to have him tell me what he told me. I didnt want to walk that route again.

and having taken TAWhatleys advice to heart. and almost agreeing accept that I knew I had to try and at least get a closer look. to be sure before I passed a death sentence.

Having put the bird on pain a pain killer. I let my gut instinct take over and I took my closer look. And after clearing away all the food matter and dead skin (along the lines of what Pidgey said) I sutured his crop up. And it is healing well. I am still tubing Kaytee and will continue to do so for about 6 more days. He is still on pain meds and antibiodics.

I have pics pf the whole process if anyone is interested. I know you all said this shouldnt be done by a non-pro and I took it to heart. but my mentor said I wasnt a non-pro having the experiance I have and she has never been wrong before.

for the first 24 hours I just subQed fluids. He is now empting his crop with normal poops.

Mandie

[Pidgey]

Whew! Well, very glad to hear it! In one of the books that I've got, there was a pretty horrible loss of the front of the crop due to a fairly large crop burn. But the back half was okay and so they let it granulate for... however long it must have taken, and then finally sewed it back up. One glance at the "Before" picture and you'd have assumed that he was a goner. The "During" pictures weren't very promising either. But the "After"... well... he lived!

And that's the way it goes, sometimes.

Pidgey

[TAWhatley]

Good on you, Mandie! I'm glad the procedure went well and that the bird is recovering. You did an AWESOME job! Please do keep us posted and send more pics if you can. As I posted, I really didn't see much of a way out for this bird, but I'm glad you tried and succeeded. I, personally, would be very interested in seeing the pictures. If you care to send them, my e-mail is TAWhatley@sbcglobal.net

Terry

[Pidgey]

Oh, by the way, according to one of my vets, they don't actually appear to feel pain when you're suturing their crops. They will flinch when you're suturing the skin, but not the crop. And, for that matter, they don't appear to feel pain when getting their oviducts worked on either. My one vet gets them under and then tapers off the anaesthesia (just like it tells to do in the Big Book) so they don't code (cardiac arrest) while under. In order to gauge how far they're under, he pays close attention to their reactions while he's working on them. They never react to the stuff done to the oviduct--only to being sewn back up when you're closing the abdominal wall and then the skin. It's a curious thing. And, curiously, there was a case of a parrot of some sort that got its foot momentarily stuck in a hanging toy in its cage and then chewed its own foot off within less than a half-hour in order to get free. You reallly gotta' wonder sometimes...

Pidgey

[Teresa]

That's amazing, Mandie, you've literally done the impossible!
Very best wishes for his continued recovery.