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Marina B Marina B is offline
Posted 10th July 2019, 10:58 AM
Join Date: May 2011
Country: South Africa
Location: Lamberts Bay
Posts: 2,321
You can give a few of those peas and make sure it gets digested. I don't know if you can get a handrearing formula. Little roll up balls of formula will also give him more vitamins than peas.
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birdtalk birdtalk is offline
Posted 10th July 2019, 12:18 PM
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by rudy View Post
Will definitely try that.
Also, we get black chickpeas here:
https://www.indiamart.com/proddetail...505150733.html

I saw videos where they are feeding pigeons these peas after soaking them overnight. I am wondering if I should try this to provide him more variety instead of just green peas everyday. That is until he builds some muscle and fat and starts feeding on his own.
Be very careful with those. They do not easily digest. I'd suggest dont mix green peaks with black chic-peas. I made that mistake once.

Despite soaking overnight those chic-peas were hard as rocks. So I semi-boiled them and fed maybe only 6-8 of those. The young pigeon definitely could not digest them.

What worked for me is 20-30 peas 3-4 times a day. In 4 days the baby gained weight and vigor, and an appetite to be fed asking for food. After that I experimented with those black chic-peas and stopped them after 3 servings of max 10 semi-boiled chic-peas

So I suggest be patient stick to green peas primarily.
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rudy rudy is offline
Posted 10th July 2019, 09:45 PM
Join Date: Mar 2012
Country: India
Posts: 32
Thanks a lot for the replies. I haven't tried the black peas yet, so I guess I will stick with the green peas till he gains weight.
His poops are the normal colour. The head wobbling is still there, but he manages to move around in a drunkard fashion. He is drinking water on his own.

I have been giving metronidazole and enrofloxacin for a week. Should I continue the enrofloxacin for another week?
I am apprehensive about the spread of PMV to my other pigeons. I am handfeeding another pigeon with broken legs, and sometimes I worry whether she will catch the disease. I switch to another set of clothers while handling the PMV pigeon, and wash my hands afterwards. Will the virus survive on surfaces like feeding bowl or the door handle which I have touched before washing my hand?
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Ladygrey Ladygrey is offline
Posted 11th July 2019, 06:09 AM
Join Date: Dec 2016
Country: ************
Posts: 707
Defrosted corn with the peas, can be added, you can make human baby cereal, make it thick and let it dry in the bowl and take pieces and feed that as well. A few dry kitten food kibbles can be added for protein as well. I would go ahead and get a pigeon mix of seeds and keep them near him, so he gets used to them, he may even try to eat them on his own at some point , esp if he can drink.
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rudy rudy is offline
Posted 11th July 2019, 06:21 AM
Join Date: Mar 2012
Country: India
Posts: 32
Thanks for the suggestions, Ladygrey. Will definitely try the corn.
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Colombina Colombina is offline
Posted 11th July 2019, 01:10 PM
Join Date: Jan 2017
Country: Italy
Posts: 718
I am apprehensive about the spread of PMV to my other pigeons. I am handfeeding another pigeon with broken legs, and sometimes I worry whether she will catch the disease. I switch to another set of clothers while handling the PMV pigeon, and wash my hands afterwards. Will the virus survive on surfaces like feeding bowl or the door handle which I have touched before washing my hand?[/QUOTE]

Hi, here you can find many information about PMV virus:

https://www.pigeonrescue.co.uk/condi...ectinghead.htm

(...)
"The disease runs its course in about 6 weeks, by that time the pigeon has stopped shedding the virus and won't infect other pigeons but nervous* and gastro-intestinal symptoms may persist longer".
(...)
"Pigeon PMV is highly infectious to other pigeons , victims should be kept isolated from other birds for at least 6 weeks. Maintain scrupulous hygiene , regularly disinfecting food and water containers with bleach. Always see to a pigeon with Pigeon PMV after you have treated your other birds. That reduces the risk of carrying the infection to other birds in your care.

The virus is mainly shed in the droppings and spreads in fecal dust,so make sure you wash your hands after contact and take care not to track fecal waste or carry fecal dust to areas where other birds are. Dispose of droppings wisely, they can be a source of infection to feral pigeons".

In addition to change your clothes you could also wear a different pair of slipper. Always treat the broken legs pigeon before the PMV pigeon.

In Italy we have a product called Amuchina which is good for disinfecting baby bottles, etc (other than for washing fruits and vegetables). Here is a link

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Amuchina-AM.../dp/B007IFNYYE

If you can find something similar, you could use it for disinfecting food and water bowls, etc. BTW amuchina has a wide range of products (for cleaning floors, additive powder, gel, etc).

You could disinfect the handle door with a surface cleaner spray.

Edit: sorry, I didn't copy the original post in the right way...
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rudy rudy is offline
Posted 12th July 2019, 02:16 AM
Join Date: Mar 2012
Country: India
Posts: 32
Thanks for the detailed reply! Yes I am feeding the pigeon with broken legs before I feed the PMV pigeon. If I cannot do that, I take a bath before feeding the pigeon with broken legs.
I have chlorox with me, I guess that will work for disinfecting?
I read the link you sent me. they talk about polyuria but I find the pigeon's poops are normal. Is it possible he is over the infection and is in the convalescence stage?

Maari is doing much better now. He eagerly gulps down the peas I give him, and then starts struggling when he's done. He tries to walk but it goes in circles. Still he never gives up. He is by far the most mild case of PMV that I have come across. Hope he gets back on his feet soon.
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Colombina Colombina is offline
Posted 15th July 2019, 06:15 AM
Join Date: Jan 2017
Country: Italy
Posts: 718
Sorry, I don't know what is chlorox... Anyway, it seems that you are maintaining a scrupulous hygiene!

I'm glad to hear that he is doing much better now.
You could give him a complete vitamin supplement (vitamins + trace elements + amino acids), you can put it in his drinking water. It will help him to stay as strong as possible. Probiotics would be helpful too.

Try to avoid any situation of stress and to maintain a daily routine, PMV pigeons are really sensitive to stress and to any small change (like replacing their bowl with a different one or moving their box/nest).

We have three PMV pigeons, 2 of them recovered well and have a happy normal "pigeon life" : they have a wife, eat on their own, fly, etc. One of them easily gets in panic (in these occasions he starts to fly in a "crazy way"), the other one sometimes moves his head in the classic PMV way, etc but they are really happy and serene pigeons. I hope that even Maari will feel better soon.

The virus runs its course in about 6/8 weeks (then starts the convalescence stage) but the symptoms could persist for longer period (the healing process could be really slow) or return in situations of stress. Some pigeons have residual symptoms for the whole life. One of our PMV pigeons unfortunately did not recover in a proper way : he can't eat on his own, can't fly, can't interact with the other pigeons in a normal way, etc. In any case, he is really sweet and friendly and can drink on his own.

Here is another link about PMV so you can read other information.

http://www.pigeon-aid.org.uk/pa/html...irus__pmv_.php

Please keep us updated.
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rudy rudy is offline
Posted 16th July 2019, 11:53 AM
Join Date: Mar 2012
Country: India
Posts: 32
Thanks Columbina..I am giving him vitamin supplement by dropper everyday. His head wobbling has reduced considerably, and now that he is better he has started treating me as a stranger!
He is still skinny, and he has a massive lice infestation - the moment I hold him, these lice are all over my hands. I am feeding him peas, and he is pooping well. He still cannot coordinate his neck movements enough to eat or drink. It is heartbreaking to see him try to eat - the bowl is quite wide, but he misses it completely.

For the lice, I have a permethrin-based spray I have bought for my dogs. But I'm dreading using it as I'm not sure Maari can handle all that toxicity. I don't use it on my dogs either as we haven't had a flea infestation for a long time now. Can some natural alternative like garlic work?

Last edited by rudy; 16th July 2019 at 12:00 PM..
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rudy rudy is offline
Posted 17th July 2019, 07:29 PM
Join Date: Mar 2012
Country: India
Posts: 32
Yesterday I felt I am not seeing poops in adequate number so I kept close watch and found that his crop is not emptying as it should. I have a doubt it is because I gave him defrosted corn instead of peas. New food - slow digestion.


Also after feeding, he did that open beak breathing with liquid coming out his beak. His crop can be barely felt, but I can feel a few corn pieces inside.

I've decided to withhold food and see. He doesn't want to drink water, so I am forcing around 0.5 ml (ACV water) down his throat every other hour. Just to get things moving.

Last edited by rudy; 17th July 2019 at 07:32 PM..
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Marina B Marina B is offline
Posted 18th July 2019, 12:13 AM
Join Date: May 2011
Country: South Africa
Location: Lamberts Bay
Posts: 2,321
I've seen that open beak breathing after feeding in a dove that had canker. He also made circular movements with his crop as if to adjust the food inside there. I treated for canker and yeast and he made a full recovery. Baytril can cause a yeast infection. Can you check deep down in the throat with a flashlight for any yellowish growths?
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rudy rudy is offline
Posted 23rd July 2019, 10:48 AM
Join Date: Mar 2012
Country: India
Posts: 32
Sorry for the late update. I had read your reply when you sent it, and had checked down his throat in good light, but his mouth is clean. A little pale but no growths.

So Maari is now more active -although going in circles most of the time, definitely walking. His head wobbling is a lot better, but he still cannot peck at seeds. He seems to be trying with laser focus, but his beak misses the food bowl entirely...Lately the weather has been real bad with heavy rains, and I have been keeping him mostly confined to his basket next to his hot bag. The other pigeon with broken legs is also inside another basket, as I don't want to expose him to the cold outside.
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Marina B Marina B is offline
Posted 24th July 2019, 08:27 AM
Join Date: May 2011
Country: South Africa
Location: Lamberts Bay
Posts: 2,321
Maybe if you put down a bigger food bowl, one that is quite deep?
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rudy rudy is offline
Posted 24th July 2019, 11:41 AM
Join Date: Mar 2012
Country: India
Posts: 32
The bowl is wide enough, it is made of clay and has a rim too so he can perch on it. But his beak goes all the way down between his feet when he tries to peck and he loses balance at times and falls into the bowl. We tried a few times in the beginning, but now I don't give him the bowl anymore. He eagerly takes the peas I handfeed him. I tried whole wheat, since it is bigger than the seeds, but it is much more difficult and time-consuming than peas.
Sometimes as I enter his room, he comes circling to me. I never thought a feral would bond like this. He is such a cutie!
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Colombina Colombina is offline
Posted 24th July 2019, 12:33 PM
Join Date: Jan 2017
Country: Italy
Posts: 718
Quote:
Originally Posted by rudy View Post
Thanks Columbina..I am giving him vitamin supplement by dropper everyday. His head wobbling has reduced considerably, and now that he is better he has started treating me as a stranger!
He is still skinny, and he has a massive lice infestation - the moment I hold him, these lice are all over my hands. I am feeding him peas, and he is pooping well. He still cannot coordinate his neck movements enough to eat or drink. It is heartbreaking to see him try to eat - the bowl is quite wide, but he misses it completely.

For the lice, I have a permethrin-based spray I have bought for my dogs. But I'm dreading using it as I'm not sure Maari can handle all that toxicity. I don't use it on my dogs either as we haven't had a flea infestation for a long time now. Can some natural alternative like garlic work?
Quote:
Originally Posted by rudy View Post
Sorry for the late update. I had read your reply when you sent it, and had checked down his throat in good light, but his mouth is clean. A little pale but no growths.

So Maari is now more active -although going in circles most of the time, definitely walking. His head wobbling is a lot better, but he still cannot peck at seeds. He seems to be trying with laser focus, but his beak misses the food bowl entirely...Lately the weather has been real bad with heavy rains, and I have been keeping him mostly confined to his basket next to his hot bag. The other pigeon with broken legs is also inside another basket, as I don't want to expose him to the cold outside.
A little pale mouth could suggest anemia. There are many causes of anemia, one of them could be blood sucking parasites.

To answer your question, I don't know if a natural remedy could really work against parasites but, yes, I read that garlic smell helps to keep lice away. You could give it a try.
I was told that lavender is good to fight parasites: you could put some sprig of lavender in his box or put 10 drops of essential oil of lavender in the bath water.
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