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Maggie-NC Maggie-NC is offline
Posted 18th May 2007, 11:08 AM
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Probable head trauma from car


Lewis picked this one up today at "the bridge". It was laying on its side by the gutter and he thought it was dead. He picked it up to move it to a grassy area and it moved so, of course, we have it now.

This one is really iffy. Eyes remain closed and every time I check on her I have to touch her to make sure she is still alive. Right now, the only thing we are doing is keeping it in a quiet, dim room with no heat on it. I am really afraid to give it anything to drink right now while it is still so comatose. May try to get her to a vet tomorrow for Metacam but right now I think it best to leave her alone.

Last edited by Maggie-NC; 12th July 2007 at 04:49 PM..
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Reti's Avatar
Reti Reti is offline
Posted 18th May 2007, 11:26 AM
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Poor thing. I am glad he is in your care now and lets hope he will come out of it.
Maybe a bit later you can rehydrate him. He might be already dehydrated and waiting until tomorrow might be too long.

Reti
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Pidgey Pidgey is offline
Posted 18th May 2007, 11:39 AM
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It's best in such a circumstance to either give the fluids Sub-Q, or a very tiny bit at a time by way of tubing and then keeping the bird very upright. At least it's laying there with its head held upright. I've had a few from the underpass that have been laying flat out--the two that I can think of both made it.

Pidgey

Last edited by Pidgey; 18th May 2007 at 03:04 PM..
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Pidgey Pidgey is offline
Posted 18th May 2007, 11:41 AM
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If there's any possibility of a broken bone within the body, the Metacam might not be a good idea. Sometimes, the best immobilization is enforced by pain.

Pidgey
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jazaroo jazaroo is offline
Posted 18th May 2007, 12:37 PM
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Maggie,

I just want to add on to what Pidgey has said about the Metacam, I while back, I had a bird that I believe was also car struck, my vet advised against giving Metacam because it will thin the blood, starting or worsening any internal bleeding. What really helps in cases like this is Dexamethasone, I don't know whether it is a a possibility of getting this guy a shot or two over the next few days. As Pidgey mentioned, hydration is very important right now to help with shock and dehydration. Looks like you have made him comfortable and glad you guys where there for him.

Good luck with him,

Ron
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AZWhitefeather AZWhitefeather is offline
Posted 18th May 2007, 01:35 PM
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Maggie,
It might not be a bad idea to put the little one on heat for even 20 minutes to ensure the body temp. is stable before administering any fluids.

I hope he pulls through.

Cindy
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Skyeking Skyeking is offline
Posted 18th May 2007, 03:02 PM
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Hi Maggie,

I'm so sad to hear about this pigeons condition but happy he is in your hands now, and what a wonderful cozy intensive care unit you have set up for the sweety.

Please do keep us updated, and hope you can dribble some hydration fluid into him/her.

I guess the heat is not applicable where trauma is suspected?



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Last edited by Skyeking; 18th May 2007 at 03:04 PM..
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Reti Reti is offline
Posted 18th May 2007, 03:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trees Gray View Post

I guess the heat is not applicable where trauma is suspected?

It is for head trauma only cause it increases the intracranial pressure which is fatal most of the time.

Reti
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Skyeking Skyeking is offline
Posted 18th May 2007, 03:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reti View Post
It is for head trauma only cause it increases the intracranial pressure which is fatal most of the time.
Reti
Thanks Reti, that is what I thought.



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Maggie-NC Maggie-NC is offline
Posted 18th May 2007, 04:31 PM
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Thank you all for your help. It is appreciated so much. We have started giving her small amounts of fluids about every hour. and she actually stands on the counter during this but her eyes are still staying closed. I kept going into her room to check on her and once she stood up, stretched one wing half-way and continued standing for about 5 minutes. Lewis went in a little later and she was stretching both wings - still with eyes closed.

I am concerned that she has not pooped - at all. I know that sometimes it takes a while for things to get moving again after a trauma but it would make me really happy to see any kind of poop.

Cindy, you know, I have always put them on heat when they're injured or sick until I read that it wasn't good for them in case of head trauma, so I didn't, at least at first. But, I did cheat and cut the heating pad on about 30 minutes before we started the fluids because she felt cool to the touch and I didn't want her to be cold when we put the fluids in. I was good though and cut it off about 30 min later. I get really confused about this because the vet has always said to put them in a dark room on heat. Just goes to show you that I trust all your advice a lot.
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Reti Reti is offline
Posted 18th May 2007, 04:46 PM
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Maggie, I learned this at the vet's clinic about the heat and head trauma.
In people I knew that head trauma patients is best to keep cool (not cold), but in a comfortable cool, semi-dark and quiet environment to avoid any unecessary stimulation. Also the head should be elevated (30-45degrees).
If you think pijie is cold, you could put a light towel on him, that won't make him too hot but will keep him comfy.
Keep on hydrating him until poops or urine show.

Reti
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pdpbison pdpbison is offline
Posted 18th May 2007, 06:50 PM
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Hi Maggie,



I believe the ACV-Water to be a good regimen for the Car-Whacked, as it aids in preventing Candida or Yeast problems in a contused Crop...and helps things all around also of course.


Their whole digestive process sometimes shuts down for a few days after a serious whallop like a speeding Car's angled Windshield catching them as they were flying low across a Street.

Wings can be fine, even legs sometimes are fine, but the whole Body otherwise has been shocked and contused...and often their Heads got some of it also of course.


If they are making their own heat decently, coolish and dim-quiet surrounds I suppose would be best.


I'd make sure the hydration is good, and just let them fast a couple of days...or the ACV-Water can have a good slug of Juice before the ACV is added to keep the right proportions even.

Then tube feed some nutritious 'Soups' once old digestive contents are comeing through, and after a couple days of that, see if he'd like some small whole Seeds, if he has his eyes open by then to see and peck them.


I have had some where I had to prop them up at that point, and for quite a while after, but they were into their pecking then, just had to have a hand to keep them from falling over.


Anyway, I feel that only small Seeds ( once past the early phases, ) for these kinds, till a week or so goes by after they are pecking again, so any swelling or clots or compromise at any points in their pre-gizzard passages do not have to oblige any large Seeds which of course get larger as they hydrate and so on.

See if the Crop feels like it has anything in it, since of course they can very well have a full or half full Crop when they got whacked.


Once his system starts going again, the Seeds in his Crop if there are any, will start going through, along with whatever was ahead of them...so, the ACV-Water is a good deal all around for these situations.


Very glad to hear the Legs and Wings are good...


He's a relatively lucky boy there...for the kind of whack he had.

Maybe that 'pin head' sized flake of plain old fashioned Aspirin might be nice for him...


I bet he feels very sore and achey and overwhelmed with both and just does not want to deal with anything just yet.



Good luck..!


Phil
Las Vegas
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Pidgey Pidgey is offline
Posted 18th May 2007, 08:23 PM
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Sometimes in order to figure out what a patient is going through, I play the "be the bird" zen kinda' thing. So, I asked myself what would make your bird want to keep its eyes closed and the thing I come up with is a whopping big headache like a migraine--that always makes me want to close my eyes. Gotta' admit that I've never thought about a bird getting one but this one was probably smacked somehow.

Pidgey
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pdpbison pdpbison is offline
Posted 18th May 2007, 11:37 PM
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..thats along the lines of what I was thinking...Headache, global Body ache, and probably lots of acid in the muscles and general system ughyness...constipated or slowed or stopped everything digestion and bowels wise...

I'd probably just close my Eyes too...


ACV-Water is cleansing for their system...so it will help that matter too.


Cool Baths if in a warm clime...


Is Aspirin contra-indicated for suspoected Brain Concussion?


If one can not see their pupils to check for symetry and dialation-response, kinda hard to say if they do not have a Brain Concussion.

I was saying a flake-of-Asprin earlier, and I possibly mis-spoke, if it is not the right thing in instances of Concussion...


Anyway...


Oye...


Phil
Las Vegas
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Reti Reti is offline
Posted 19th May 2007, 04:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pdpbison View Post
..

Is Aspirin contra-indicated for suspoected Brain Concussion?




Phil
Las Vegas

Aspirin would be contraindicated in head trauma.

Reti
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