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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
hi,

has it ever occured to you guys when the baby expires just before it fully breaks open the top shell? it's able to poke a wide hole it's just not able to break away from the shell. could it be the shell is so thick that it's having a hard time cracking it fully? this is the 2nd time on the same pair.


kalapati
http://myracingpigeons.mypets.ws:81/jview.htm
 

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Not very likely

hi,

has it ever occured to you guys when the baby expires just before it fully breaks open the top shell? it's able to poke a wide hole it's just not able to break away from the shell. could it be the shell is so thick that it's having a hard time cracking it fully? this is the 2nd time on the same pair.


kalapati
http://myracingpigeons.mypets.ws:81/jview.htm

When they die in the shell, it is often an indication of disease in the flock. Do you treat with any kind of preventive meds?

Bill
 

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In addition, make sure they are getting enough variety in their diet to supply them with the needed variety of vitamins and essential minerals, especially calcium and iodine, and trace elements. A good source of grit will also help.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 · (Edited)
When they die in the shell, it is often an indication of disease in the flock. Do you treat with any kind of preventive meds?

Bill

all my birds are PMV, SalBac and Pox immunized and those are the only preventive meds + a dewormer that i keep. i got this 5-1 combo from Vita-king but i haven't used it after my wife (an RN) cautioned me. she said it's not a good practice to implement those antibiotics without being sure of the right strain of bugs that infect them or they may not be infected at all. it may also cause a mutation of other dormant bugs to become superbugs (antibiotic resistant).

i just make it sure that my loft is clean all the time to prevent or minimize infections.





In addition, make sure they are getting enough variety in their diet to supply them with the needed variety of vitamins and essential minerals, especially calcium and iodine, and trace elements. A good source of grit will also help.

i have grits and oysters always. but on my next trip to JEDDS i'll make sure i'll buy those pickpots.


i appreciate your feedbacks.


kalapati
http://myracingpigeons.mypets.ws:81/jview.htm
 

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HI KALAPATI,There many reasons for embryonic death. 1Improper conditions in the nest box, too hot,too cold,poor ventilation #2 exacessive jarring or shaking of eggs: this can happen when transfering eggs to foster parents also too much handling by the fancier, birds fighting in the nest box. #3poor quality eggs,cracked, thin,mis-shaped eggs,rough eggs, all these allow easy entry of infection#4 Improper incubation this is due to poor parenting,parasites,over interference by the fancier #5 poor parental nutrition. Lack of vitmins and minerals..................I feel that many fanciers those new to the hobbie just handle the eggs to much. GEORGE;)
 

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You said it had made a large hole in the egg trying to hatch. NOW at times what happens is when a large hole is made but not the full pipping of the egg. The membrane skin around the inside of the shell Well it drops down and drys on the hatching young bird. Then the young bird is basicly trapped And dies in the shell. This happens from time to time. 1 way to help is if the bird has been unable to hatch over the day after you notice it does have a larger hole. You help it out of the shell. If not it may just not make it out. NOW only do this if you see it is heving trouble. .
 

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all my birds are PMV, SalBac and Pox immunized and those are the only preventive meds + a dewormer that i keep. i got this 5-1 combo from Vita-king but i haven't used it after my wife (an RN) cautioned me. she said it's not a good practice to implement those antibiotics without being sure of the right strain of bugs that infect them or they may not be infected at all. it may also cause a mutation of other dormant bugs to become superbugs (antibiotic resistant).

i just make it sure that my loft is clean all the time to prevent or minimize infections.








i have grits and oysters always. but on my next trip to JEDDS i'll make sure i'll buy those pickpots.


i appreciate your feedbacks.


kalapati
http://myracingpigeons.mypets.ws:81/jview.htm

Give the some lugols solution (iodine) Make sure that you get the Iodine for birds. Do it once a month. I am not saying that is your problem but every time I have that happen it was remedied by iodine. As a matter of fact I haven't had that happen to me for years.

Also paratyphoid (salmonella) will do the same thing. It is transmitted to the egg by the female. If you are having a lot of one hatch nest and raising mostly
cock birds then you need to treat for paratyphoid

I have an uncle who is a doctor and my wife is a nurse also. Pre treating for disease only treats what is ailing the birds at that time. If they have no problems the medicine is just filtered out of the body. Like your wife has stated it is a good way to develop medicine proof strains of disease. You will be better served if you will give your birds a dose of good gut bacteria once a month. I don't worm my birds as they are not allowed out of the loft on the ground. I don't pre treat for disease. I have had canker in my loft in two different nest of babies. Both out of the same pair of Mexican Jansen's. To test them I switched the third set of eggs under a old pair of birds that had never had canker. The babies had canker in their throat in 10 days. They were carriers so I carried them to the compost pile. I haven't had a case of canker since I disposed of that pair of birds. That was six years ago when I first got these Jansen's. The best way to keep your birds healthy is to fly them daily. To never over crowd them. Give them good dry grain and clean water daily. I keep three inches of sifted droppings on the floor that I sift daily. A very good friend of mine is Dr John Ervin DVM. When he instructed me to leave droppings I was scrapping every day. When I first met him he was in charge of the pathology lab at Ft. Knox, KY. I figured if the Army was satisfied with his knowledge of animals I was too. That was 35 years ago. Since I have adopted this practice I haven't had a sick bird other than the canker I mentioned above.
 

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Give the some lugols solution (iodine) Make sure that you get the Iodine for birds. Do it once a month. I am not saying that is your problem but every time I have that happen it was remedied by iodine. As a matter of fact I haven't had that happen to me for years.

Also paratyphoid (salmonella) will do the same thing. It is transmitted to the egg by the female. If you are having a lot of one hatch nest and raising mostly
cock birds then you need to treat for paratyphoid

I have an uncle who is a doctor and my wife is a nurse also. Pre treating for disease only treats what is ailing the birds at that time. If they have no problems the medicine is just filtered out of the body. Like your wife has stated it is a good way to develop medicine proof strains of disease. You will be better served if you will give your birds a dose of good gut bacteria once a month. I don't worm my birds as they are not allowed out of the loft on the ground. I don't pre treat for disease. I have had canker in my loft in two different nest of babies. Both out of the same pair of Mexican Jansen's. To test them I switched the third set of eggs under a old pair of birds that had never had canker. The babies had canker in their throat in 10 days. They were carriers so I carried them to the compost pile. I haven't had a case of canker since I disposed of that pair of birds. That was six years ago when I first got these Jansen's. The best way to keep your birds healthy is to fly them daily. To never over crowd them. Give them good dry grain and clean water daily. I keep three inches of sifted droppings on the floor that I sift daily. A very good friend of mine is Dr John Ervin DVM. When he instructed me to leave droppings I was scrapping every day. When I first met him he was in charge of the pathology lab at Ft. Knox, KY. I figured if the Army was satisfied with his knowledge of animals I was too. That was 35 years ago. Since I have adopted this practice I haven't had a sick bird other than the canker I mentioned above.
Apparently you didn't read the rules of our forum. Please do that. We do not condone, no matter what the reason is, killing/culling any animals, especially pigeons since this is a pigeon forum.
 

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Apparently you didn't read the rules of our forum. Please do that. We do not condone, no matter what the reason is, killing/culling any animals, especially pigeons since this is a pigeon forum.
Vouteman .. what Renee has posted is correct. We do not condone lethal culling on the forum. I know you are new, so please make note of this fact.

I do appreciate your information and hope you will continue posting about remedies that have worked for you .. like the Lugol's ..

Terry
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
HI KALAPATI,There many reasons for embryonic death. 1Improper conditions in the nest box, too hot,too cold,poor ventilation #2 exacessive jarring or shaking of eggs: this can happen when transfering eggs to foster parents also too much handling by the fancier, birds fighting in the nest box. #3poor quality eggs,cracked, thin,mis-shaped eggs,rough eggs, all these allow easy entry of infection#4 Improper incubation this is due to poor parenting,parasites,over interference by the fancier #5 poor parental nutrition. Lack of vitmins and minerals..................I feel that many fanciers those new to the hobbie just handle the eggs to much. GEORGE;)

hi george,

i appreciate your feedback. i'm sure i don't have these conditions mentioned above. i noticed that you're from oceanside. we have a branch office there that i visit at least once a month. maybe i can visit your loft when we both have the chance. i am from lemon grove which is about 40 miles south. i want to join a club here in san diego which club do you belong? do you have any recommendations?



You said it had made a large hole in the egg trying to hatch. NOW at times what happens is when a large hole is made but not the full pipping of the egg. The membrane skin around the inside of the shell Well it drops down and drys on the hatching young bird. Then the young bird is basicly trapped And dies in the shell. This happens from time to time. 1 way to help is if the bird has been unable to hatch over the day after you notice it does have a larger hole. You help it out of the shell. If not it may just not make it out. NOW only do this if you see it is heving trouble. .

hi re lee,

it could be inner 2nd layer of the shell has dried out. i remember that day was dry windy day. thanks for the input.


kalapati
San Diego
http://myracingpigeons.mypets.ws:81/jview.htm
 
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