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I have a young 2 month old Lahore that presented with a small lesion on the side of his face at 2 weeks of age. The lesion has grown from the corner of his mouth to the end of his beak rapidly over the last 5 days. The lesion is not in his throat or mouth and doest not present like a normal canker case. It is not weeping the cheese like discharge. There is a yellowish discharge under the skin. He is eating but has difficulty picking up seed and water. I am treating as canker but questioning if this is the right thing to do. Resources to pigeon vets are limited in my area. I am syringe feeding twice daily right now and sponging the area with vinegar. Has anyone seen canker on the outside of the beak and not in the mouth, crop or throat?
 

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This does not look like canker to me it looks like an abscesses and the infection is swelling up along side of the beak. I think that you need to get this bird on a antibiotic to fight the infection.I think that someone that does work with sick and injured birds can better help you than I could.GEORGE;)
 

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Given the rapid growth rate and the fact it has not moved into the throat, you are probably looking at a cancerous growth.

In order to continue its rapid growth it will need to connect itself into the bird's blood supply for nutrients. There are some drugs that target that process but I do not know what access you may have. Consider trying a vascular constricting medication, like one of the anti-hemhorroidals.

Another alternative is surgery.
 

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I don't think it's cancer and I do think your bird need evaluation by a vet that treats birds. The bird looks like she is in pain. Please don't mess around with this on your own and call the closest avian vet near you. Please tell them this is a pet pigeon. If they don't treat pigeons ask for a referral to a vet that does.
It could be canker.



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This doesn't look like canker or cancer. Besides cancer in such a young bird is very, very rare.
I have to agree with George, looks more like an infection and as Charis mentioned it would be best to take her to a vet to get a proper diagnosis.

Reti
 

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That dosn't look like canker to me, i would be surprised if it is !
canker usually found in digestive tract & the respiratory system
(ex. throat, navel, sinus, crop and cloacal). Could be pox but you
said it was there when the pigeon was 2 weeks old, now its 2
months and it started to grow rapidly 5 days ago and it has
yellowish discharge .. does pox act like this?.

I was informed that those who breed parrots encounter a similar
problem caused by a virus ( PBFD ) and don't know if it infect
pigeons and i understand there's no vaccines/treatment.

But then again i'm not vet/expert so i could be wrong.
 

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OK all .. IF it's pox, then taking the bird to a vet isn't the answer .. pox is caused by a virus and there is no treatment aside from good supportive care (meaning make sure the bird is eating and drinking and that you are treating the pox lesions with a drying agent to speed up the time for them to dry up and drop off).

If it's an abscess, then for sure an antibiotic is needed and IF it's canker then an anti-protozoal drug is needed.

From what I, personally, see in the pic .. it is canker. JMO .. A vet opinion would be a very, very good thing to have about now.

Terry
 

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If you can't take him to a vet, then I would suggest to treat with a canker medicine and a broad spectrum antibiotic and topically with a drying agent. Wait three days and see what happens, if it doesn't seem to get any better then you will have to take him to a vet.

Reti
 

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If you can't get the bird to a local vet, then get the bird to a local bird rehabber, as they can probably tell you exactly what it is.

Treating the bird for all issues, may be a good idea at this point, as you don't want the bird to suffer anymore.

I would do what Reti says, and you can use colloidal silver as a topical treatment.
 

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OK all .. IF it's pox, then taking the bird to a vet isn't the answer .. pox is caused by a virus and there is no treatment aside from good supportive care (meaning make sure the bird is eating and drinking and that you are treating the pox lesions with a drying agent to speed up the time for them to dry up and drop off).

If it's an abscess, then for sure an antibiotic is needed and IF it's canker then an anti-protozoal drug is needed.

From what I, personally, see in the pic .. it is canker. JMO .. A vet opinion would be a very, very good thing to have about now.

Terry
:confused: take him to the vet, or don't take him,... which is it? you say one thing and then another,???.... the vet would be nice for a novice, to help give tips on the supportive care. If no vet then I guess he should treat for canker then and do supportive care as usual.......quick look...well, the person is a vet tech so I guess she/he has it coverd.
 

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DOL,
This lesion has been visible for 2 months.
How long have you been treating the bird for canker?

OK all ..
IF it's pox, then taking the bird to a vet isn't the answer ..
pox is caused by a virus and there is no treatment aside from good supportive care (meaning make sure the bird is eating and drinking and that you are treating the pox lesions with a drying agent to speed up the time for them to dry up and drop off).

If it's an abscess, then for sure an antibiotic is needed and IF it's canker then an anti-protozoal drug is needed.

From what I, personally, see in the pic .. it is canker. JMO ..

A vet opinion would be a very, very good thing to have about now.

Terry
:confused: take him to the vet or don't take him which is it? you say one thing and then another

* well the person is a vet tech so I guess she has it coverd.
That's the problem here. In this particular instance (as in many instances), it's a guessing game.
It may or may not be pox or canker. It's possible it could be something else.
Charis has provided quite a list of vets in the CO area. Let's hope one of them is near enough to DOL to utilize.

* Apparently she doesn't. "I am treating as canker but questioning if this is the right thing to do.

Cindy
 

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It is disconcerting when we contradict each other on "diagnosis", in this case it is inevitable as whatever the baby is suffering from doesn't seem to fit in exactly with any of the common ailments, but as has been pointed out it is obviously very painful!

The pox virus runs a natural course of 4-6 weeks, with the birds spontaneously recovering at that stage. In this case it appears that the original vesicle started to grow after 6 weeks, which would make pox unlikely. But there is a photo of a pigeon with a pox lesion on the beak in this thread, for comparison:

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showthread.php?t=17442&referrerid=560

As alhowiriny says, canker follows the digestive tract. Although there is yellow crusting, this is unlikely to be caused by canker if there is nothing inside the mouth.

Dr Colin Walker provides some interesting guidelines on distinguishing pox lesions from canker. He says:

1. The site of the lesion. If an imaginary line is drawn through the base of the bird's beak, then any lesions netween this line and the tip of the beak are likely to be pox vesicles. This area is too hostile and exposed for trichomonad organisms to survive..

2. Attachment to the surrounding tissue - as canker lesions invade, here is often a fragile line of inflammation at the edge of the lesion, which enables the separation ogf the canker nodule from the surrounding tissue. The pox lesion is a vesicle or blister of the mouth lining itself, and so cannot be separated from it.


I was informed that those who breed parrots encounter a similar
problem caused by a virus ( PBFD ) and don't know if it infect
pigeons and i understand there's no vaccines/treatment.
Pige3ons don't get PBDF (Pscittacine Beak and Feather Disease), that is a circovirus that is specific to hookbills, but pigeons have their own circovirus. It attacks the pigeon's immune system (is called Pigeons AIDS) and although it can cause viral ulcers in the mouth it is most likely to kill a pigeon that young very quickly.
 

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Obviously if the infection is bacterial it will respond to antibiotic with 48-72 hours. If there is no response then as TAWhatley says it is most likely a viral infection. Either way in two to three days you have an answer.

By the way DLF if it should be a viral problem, anti-viral meds are currently available- by prescription or by a friendly vet. Whether they work on birds as well as humans is still an open question, but better than nothing.
 

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Thank you 'cyro51' for the clarification.

I found this on a book titled : Avian Pathology, there's too much info there but
this's what i could type.

Necropsy Findings (Page 453)
... it must be appreciated that 18 females studied represent only a sample. all
of which had beak lesions. By contrast all of the male birds were examined at
necropsy and 49 out of 66 found to have beak lesions (74%) bacteriological
swabs yielded moderate to heavy growths of haemolytic. coagulase postive.
staphylocci.

Beak lesions occurred either individually or in comination at three sites -
beneath the nares on the maxilla or on the mandible. ...
Histopathological findings (Page 463)
... scabs formed which contained comparable material to that described above.
together with colonies of Gram-positive cocci, variable haemorrhage. inflammatory
cells and often but not invariably, particles of food. ...
 

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This's worth reading.

Scaly Face Mites
http://www.avianweb.com/scaly.html

Clinical symptoms include pitting; scaly, crusty lesions; localized swelling of tissue;
and the affected areas are the beak, face (scaly face)

The lesions develop very slowly, so that an infected bird may appear normal for a
long period of time. It is thought that these mites are acquired in the nest, with the
infection remaining latent for a long period of time.

Beak & Cere: Tiny non-itching, wart-like lesions appear at the commissures of the
beak or around the cere. Advanced infestation spreads to the unfeathered parts of
the body.

The involved beak and skin develop a roughened honeycombed appearance consisting
of tiny pits and tunnels. The beak becomes distorted as the mites affect the zone of
growth. Many birds will require life-long beak trims and shaping.
 
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