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Discussion Starter #1
Tonight my husband brought home a pij that was in the water at the marina and after reading I have decided he is ill with a virus. He twists his head and is dizzy and falls over I cannot give him rescue fluids because his head moves all over the place. I have him in the house on a low heating pad and covered with cotton tee shirt. What else should I be doing? Should we be worried about our other pets or ourselves? We want to help him.
 

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Where are you located? We may have a member nearby that could help you with the bird if needed.

Right now, warm, dry, dark and quiet is good for the bird. Let it settle down for a few hours and then offer some seed and water.

Since you pulled this bird from the water, it is possible that it ingested a lot of nasty water which included gas, oil, and who knows what. That alone could be enough to cause the twisting and dizziness. It is highly unlikely that this bird has anything that could be transmitted or be harmful to you or your pets.

Terry
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Terry, Thank you for the quick response as it is getting late and I must rise early. I am in Washington State near Tacoma.
 

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Terry, Thank you for the quick response as it is getting late and I must rise early. I am in Washington State near Tacoma.
Thanks for the location .. please let us know how the pigeon is doing in the morning. Please continue to keep the bird warm and stress free, and let us know if the dizziness and twisting has subsided or not. It is possible the bird has PMV, but this is totally the wrong time of year for it.

Terry
 

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hi Giantee,



Hypothermia is the usual effect of being immersed too long in even 'cool' Water, let along 'cold' Water...


This can make anyone very 'off' or 'drunk-acting' and so on.


So, yes, as Terry mentions, keep him 'warm' for sure by providing actual warmth with a Heating Pad, and drape whatever he is in so no drafts can reach him..


Might be a day or more for him to spring 'back'...



In fact, keep him in a white Towell so you can see and evaluate the Poops.


If he is 'sick' from something which was effecting him prior to his Water adventure, seeing 'no poops' will be a clue to his having not been eating.

Might be a youngster, too...


Can you post some sort of close up images of him?



Anyway, good luck!


Thanks for rescuing him!


Phil
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It is possible the bird has PMV, but this is totally the wrong time of year for it.
It is strange that you should say that, Terry, because most of my PMV rescues have been found in winter. This year John found Holly and Jayne found Anastasia, last year John found Noel. They were all Christmas rescues. Hurdy, Gurdy and Blackie were found in late November 2000 and Bully, Smoothy and Micky were found in January: I remember that **** was swishing his beak through the snow which alerted me to the fact that something was odd, closer examination revealed fine tremors of his eyes and head. There are more winter victims , those are the ones I didn't have to dig into my records to find details.

Maybe we have a "winter" strain here that hasn't reached you?

Giantee, her is a link to PMV, its symptoms and treatment.

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showthread.php?t=12250&referrerid=560

Cynthia
 

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I also brought home a few PMV pigeons (adults) this winter and one youngster with symptoms a week ago. The adults all recovered, the youngster did not make it.
In Belgium I find PMV victims all year round.
 

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It could also be that some PMV-infected pigeons manage to live with it until such a time as they get worn out by cold weather or lack of food, both of which can occur in winter...
 

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It is strange that you should say that, Terry, because most of my PMV rescues have been found in winter.

Maybe we have a "winter" strain here that hasn't reached you?

Cynthia
If there is a winter strain in the U.K., please feel free to keep it there .. what we have here in the U.S. is plenty! :)

Seriously, I would have to go back through my records and see if there is a particular time of year that I've gotten PMV birds in. Off the top of my head, it seems they arrived in the late summer and fall, but I could be wrong about that.

Terry
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Hey everyone, Thank you for all the info. I get a rescue animal or bird at least once a month. Last month it was a diving loon,They just seem to find me. The pij slept all night on his heating blanket and when I got up this a.m. he drank two little cups of rescue fluids and ate a bunch of seed. I really think the hypothermia theory was it. There is no food source for feral birds in lil ol Gig Harbor and I think he sucomed to hunger. Now im fearful to release him do to the same problem. I want to take him back there to where all the others are but dont want this to happen again. Any suggestions? Thank you again!!!!:)
 

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You could keep him until he fattens up and the weather warms... then...keep him in an enclosure in your yard and support him with food. After a week or so, let him go but leave food out. Maybe he will bring his friends and family to your house. :)
At the least, he will know where to come if he is hungry.:cool:
 

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Discussion Starter #13
I would do that but the lady next door feeds birds and I have seen the pigeon hawk swoop in for the kill on many occasions. That would be a heart breaker for sure.
 

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I have seen two PMV pigeons this winter.

The first, PP2C ("pee-pee-two-see") for Pigeon with 2 Pale Claws, was the same pigeon I took to Taubenklinik Essen (pigeon clinic in Essen, Germany) for a lump under her right foot on Monday, November 26, 2007. The lady doctor did a crop swab (we could observe the live action of the microbes under the microscope, on the video screen connected to the microscope). No large amounts of bad microbes. She did a blood test, and reported a few days later that the pigeon didn't have paratyphoid/salmonellosis. The lump under the left foot where the toes join, about the size of a peanut, was due to trauma, she figured. PP2C flew out a day or so later.

I had a bit of work coming up with PP2C's name: her main left toe and the inner toe of his left foot have pale toenails or claws. The others are dark. It is about the only way I can identify him.

On the way to the pigeon clinic, at the Duisdorf main train station, I also rescued a squeaker with right leg broken near the hip. He is with the re-habber Christa G., and she thinks he may have to have his leg re-broken and re-set, since he falls over. I have to check back with her to see what happened with him. I named him Deuce von Duisdorf, since he was one of a pair of birds I took that day, and "Deuce" rhymes with "Duis-" of Duisdorf.

On Thursday January 10th I noticed PP2C was having trouble eating seeds. I enticed her inside, fed her for a week, and let her out on January 17th. He is doing fine. Saw him today. I made video clips of him, with his head upside down. I will upload them to Google video sometime and link to them, for reference purposes, or load them into YouTube. So much to do.

The second PMV pigeon: On Saturday January 19th, 2008, I saw a bunch of tail feathers and smaller white insulating feathers on the street below, a bit farther down the street from our window. No blood or carcass. I think a raptor got the pigeon. He had been sick for a while, a month maybe, sitting slightly fluffed up and less active than the other neighboring pigeons. The day before I tried to entice him inside with seeds, but he showed not much interest. He did go to some seeds I set on a hard to reach windowsill, and had trouble pecking. I made two swipes at him with a net with fine mesh, sold to me "for pigeons." The net had about a twelve-inch diameter opening, and wen the pigeon had his wings spread he was able to keep from being scooped into the net. I had to reach and stretch for him, and couldn't be too obvious about it, lest the neighbors see. Missed him, and he flew off. He was a local pigeon who had a wee bit of trust in me, and I simply added to his miseries. I figure a quick death, if such it were, might have been a blessing for him, and a meal for the raptor, and a better choice than a healthier, escaping pigeon who suffered broken bones or injuries from an unsuccessful raptor attack. When I die, don't mind being recycled by animals, small microorganisms or larger predators. I should phrase that, after I die.

Cynthia,

It occurred to me that Britain's pigeons might be better off if they had a milder strain of PMV from the continent to help them ward off a more virulent strain. At the London Wildlife Center, Kittypaws says they routinely euthanize PMV pigeons, since only 2 percent survive, even after extensive care and treatment. Just a thought, maybe eventually even an opinion.

We have had some mild weather with damp and wet conditions, fluctuating or alternating with colder weather the past month or so: great for colds, and for flu. Good for viruses.

Larry
 

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hi Giantee,


Glad to hear he is appearing like an all-right Pigeon now and eating and drinking and so on..!


Do keep him on a white towell in order to evaluate the poops...


Best wishes!


Phil
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If the bird is starving, that's about what I would expect the poops to look like. I'd give it a day or so, with food, to see if they firm up.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
PMV feral needs our help!!!!!!!!

Pij from Wa. St. that was found in water is not well today. Neck rolling and drunk with star gazing. Yesterday he was fine. I read about pmv and there is a lot of meds and terminology beyond my skills. I understand pmv lasts around six weeks and then what? Is there someone in Wa. st. who can help pij and I?.
 

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There is a place in Tacoma called Tradewinds that carries many pigeon supplies. You should be able to find everything you need there. You are very fortunate you have a pigeon supply close.
 

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Certainly sounds like he has PMV and the uncontrolled movements and loss of flight co-ordination got him where he was.

There is no medication for PMV once they have it. It's just keeping them in a not-too-bright place, quiet and away from animals, children or much 'passing traffic' in the house, with something soft as their floor.

If he has no control, then it can be a case of hand feeding for a while. A rehabber could feed him on a semi liquid food into his crop, but unless/until one can be found (one who will take in a PMV case and not put it down), he could initially be fed, just to get some food into him, on

small pellets of dampened bread (pref wholemeal) and/or
frozen corn & peas, thawed in hot water for about 20 mins

He would have to be given each one at a time directly towards the back of his mouth, if he cannot transfer food from front of beak into mouth (they often toss seed etc. as the head jerks).

PMV alone does not have a high mortality, but starvation through inability to pick up and hold food is a major cause of fatalities.

Best bet will probably be to wrap pij in a towel or something so just his head peeks out when feeding.

He will also need water. A small pot or, at first, just water dripped into the beak (not squirted into mouth, as it can go down the airway). He can also have a deep pot or dish of seed .. mixed corn, pigeon or dove mix, wild bird food ... if he is still able to pick food up and eat. It would need to be deep, as they frequently have to make a wild plunge at food because of the head/neck movements.

John
 
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