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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi all,
My heart is pounding as I'm typing this. I think there is something wrong with Krikky :(

For the past few days, I (the human) has been ill - parched throat, fever, giddiness - and Krikky seems ok. But today, I am still unwell and there is a major difference in Krikky's behaviour.

She hasn't eaten her food or drank water at all today. I know because I change the bowls daily and they are untouched. She eats her usual peanut treats (about 3-4 this morning) and just sat on her eggs the whole day.

When I was changing the bowl, she rushed to the bowl, tried to peck a few seeds but had trouble swallowing - almost as if it was too painful or uncomfortable. Thinking it was a feather as she preens a lot, I offered her the bowl of water, with a small sip she retracted as if it was hurting her, and she didn't want to drink although I could see she was very thirsty!

She has been sneezing almost every night, and honestly so have I, and my brother in the next room.

Krikky has always eaten her food and drink her water, and always very cheery. But today she seems withdrawn. So I got into her cage and tried, very unsuccessfully, to wrap her in a cloth to check her throat. I couldn't pry it open, she struggled so much, but I saw it was dark and bluish???

Please can you advise;
1. How do I catch her and open her beak so I can see clearly? Please share with photos and instructions, I am a wimp when it comes to handling her. She's very feisty!

2. What medication can I buy for this sneezing and non-eating throat problem?

Oh by the way, Krikky has been treated with Metronizadolum about a year ago but if need be, I will medicate her again.

Going to the vet will be the last resort because;
1. If I go to the vet, I might be arrested for keeping a pigeon. It's a very strict country and I don't want the vet visit to be the reason Krikky gets confiscated from me. I don't care if I go to jail, I just don't want Krikky to be captured and disposed by the authorities if the vet reports me.

2. There is only one public avian vet, and I am doubtful he knows anything about pigeon.

3. I am very ill at the moment, flu, fever, clogged nose/throat and I havent been to the Dr myself. I fear that if I go to the vet, with my current condition, he might suspect the bird flu or whatnot and I just don't want Krikky to be accused of anything. This is a paranoid country with zero tolerance for pigeons.

I hope you can help. What do I need to do??? I am so worried!
 

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I'm so sorry to hear about Krikky. Seems like she could have a respiratory infection, I hope experts here will come to your help.
You need to wrap a towel around her several times, and tell yourself that no matter what happens, you are going to look down that throat. Wrapping around several times will make her immobile, and also give you better grip on her. You can hold her against your chest (or whichever position is most comfortable) and pry open the beak. I feel pigeons stop struggling if held with their belly up. Maybe what you will find down there can save her life. Since she is not weak yet, I think we have time on our side.
I just hope Krikky feels better soon. Also that you get the strength to look after her. I will pray for both of you.
 

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Forgot to mention another thing. Sometimes pigeon's throat can seem whitish or bluish if your'e looking in bad light. So make sure to look into his beak in good daylight.
 

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Well, it is either a blockage or illness.

I am sorry you are feeling ill. I was actually going to say you are acting a bit paranoid, but then I remembered you are in Singapore and not here or somewhere else.

Some thoughts:

1) Do you have a friend (healthy) who can bring Krikky to the avian vet for you ? Do you have any bands you can place on his leg, so as to indicate he is 'owned' by you, not a stray Feral ?

The vet is still the best bet from a medical point of view...we have no idea what we are dealing with here. But I understand your reasons for not doing that. If not, then you are left with some courses of actiion which are nothing but 'best-guess':

2) If it is a blockage due to inflammation, Metacam/Meloxicam might reduce any swelling and at least give Krikky some respite from feeling bad and having breathing difficulty.

3) As Kunju says, it could just be canker...I mean, her symtoms are not incongruous with canker. So you culd start Metronidazole and see what that does.

In both of the above, I understand the problem that Krikky seems not to be able to ingest anything, so oral dosing meds might not get much down into the crop. In such an instance, a needle syringe shot would be a better delivery system.....but that gets us back to the vet issue ....so also becomes a risk in a sense.

4) In any instance, if your decision is to try to treat at home, you really have to towel him, take him out of his enclosure, and open that beak. I have seen phlegmatic canker birds where their beaks have almost been 'glued' shut by the phlegm...but the fact that you were able to open the beak and peer in for an instant would seem to suggest this is not the case , here.

That's all I can think of at the moment....I too am praying for you both.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Thank you all for responding. I truly appreciate it. Sorry for the late reply, I have been sleeping after taking my meds :(

I wouldn't be paranoid about the vet if I was living elsewhere. But you know, it's where I am...

I'm going to try to pry open her beak one more time in morning light. Hopefully I can see what's in there. I have asked my mom and brother to help - as I need more hands.

I also noticed she has mucous... and when she tries to eat, the food get stuck to her beak and she tries to puff them out... is this also a sign of respiratory? I don't think it's canker but if I give her metronidazole, it won't cause problems right?

No more peanuts for Krikky for the next 6 months! It's like pampering your child with candies and now she's got diabetes. I feel awful!

One more question;
Can I give these meds at the same time - and what dosage should I use? In what form can I buy them and most importantly from where?

1) Metacam
2) Doxycycline
3) Metronidazole

Thanks Dima for the link - I hope I won't hurt Krikky by prying her mouth open like that.

Again, many, many thanks for your help!!
 

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I know it's hard to open to beak of some pigeons, but i squeeze at the base with thumb and index of left hand and open with thumb and index of right hand..More people it wouldn't help. Only the second person to keep a flashlight so you can see better.

It could be also Candida, for that Nystatin would do great. It's a fungus infection/ yeastlike in digestive tract. Peanuts could case that IMO.

Metronidazole 40 mg once a day
Doxyciline..i think 0.2 cc ( someone can confirm)
Personally, I wouldn't give Metacam...
 

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I wouldn't do the metacam either. You need to look down the throat with a small flashlight in order to really see well. Canker can cause a blockage where the feed gets stuck and won't go down, and it also cause mucous.What do her poops look like? You can give the Metronidazole in the evening, and the doxy in the evening. I would probably try the Metro first for a few days and see if it helps. I would give a double dose to start, which would be 100 mg, then 50 mg daily for another 7 to 10 days, and see how it goes. May need a bit longer treatment. The Doxy comes in tablet form, and gives instructions as to amount to give.
 

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Has she had a break from the eggs since she first ever started laying, I am guessing here but maybe sitting all the time could have made her unfit, I know if humans sit, eat and drink they can develop breathing difficulties.
 

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If it IS canker then Metacam will do no good. If you conclude it is NOT canker, I strongly suggest you give the Metacam (.05cc) and the Doxy, maybe an hour apart. If the throat/esophagus/respiratory inflammation is from something other than canker, Metacam will likely reduce the inflammation.

If there is no improvement in the first 12 hours, discontinue the Metacam. ASgain, this is only if you determine it not to be canker.

The only thing which Metacam can exacerbate is a renal illness. This does not seem to be a renal illness. It won't exacerbate a virus or fungal or bacterial infection. So the chances of it hurting anything, IMHO, are quite slim.

Still sounds to me like canker, that would be my first guess...especially the new appearance of phlegm.

This is tricky because some of the med needs to get down a passage which is clearly not allowing much to go down. Best of luck....

Keep us posted.
 

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Check to be sure that there is no food caught down the throat also.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Hi all,
Really, I LOVE YOU GUYS SOOOOO MUCH!!!

Thank you for everything! Last night, with my raging fever and clogged nose/throat, I decided to sleep in the living room and left Krikky in my room. The next morning, I COMPLETELY recovered!! No mucous (for me), no fever and I'm energised! (I did eat meds last night)

I had to go for an interview today (thus being MIA from Pigeon biz) and leave Krikky for 2 hours. I was VERY worried because when I left at 2pm, I discovered mucous and her jaw was swollen. Her lower beak extended and it looked like she was having lumps!

Without said, I was almost crying during the interview and told the guy I had to send my bird to the vet (so I'm not sure if I got the job or not) This is like deja-vu of the time when I saved the now-deceased baby mynah... also smack during an interview!

So anyway, I rushed home like crazy, called every vet in Singapore - to test the waters - "avian vet?" "pigeon-friendly?" "do you have metro" "doxy and metacam?" "yes ok i want to make an appointment immediately"

So I did. Seeing Krik-Krik in that state, face all bloated up, I knew I couldn't self-medicate her. I bit the bullet, rushed to buy a new pet carrier, rushed back home, lured Krikky into the bag (with eggs), and then rushed to the vet.

I am glad I did. She was FANTASTIC!! I was soooo defensive at first, fearing she might not know anything about pigeons but it turned out that there were a few great samaritans who took feral pigeons to her before.

So she checked Krikky thoroughly. The way she handled my precious bird was so impressive! Firm but gentle! Krikky was so obedient, the little doll! She hopped back into the carrier and sat like a very good girl while the doctor addressed us (me and bro).

It turns out - SHE HAS CANKER! A massive one, that is causing the swelling - and this is the treatment. You guys rock, it's exactly as you have suggested!

1. Metronidazole suspension - 30 ml - 0.15ml every 12 hours - just a drop into her beak and let her swallow naturally. For 10 days.

2. Meloxicam - 5ml - 0.08ml once a day - same procedure as above

3. Krikky is having problems eating so I have to feed her like a baby - Kaytee Exact liquid food - and if possible, add the meds into that.

4. Krikky is underweight!! She weighs only 245g - so more carbohydrates need to be introduced into her diet.

5. The sneezing is normal. She checked her lungs and and nostrils and concluded there is absolutely nothing wrong with her respiratory system. Because both my brother and I sneeze a lot too, it's probably my room!

So that's it. The doctor was awesome! She never mentioned about the law or anything. She was very caring and knowledgeable. I should have more pride in my countrymen next time!! The clinic was packed but no one threatened to report me or anything, all they did was gushed how beautiful Krikky is - like a mini celebrity!

So now my racing heart has subsided into relief. The hard part, giving the meds. Thank goodness I'm unemployed at the moment and have all the time in the world.

I will not hesitate to go to Dr Gloria Lee from now onwards. For future feral rescue, as well as Krikky. I am so impressed and thankful I might send her a bouquet of flowers!!

THANK YOU ALL SO MUCH! I swear I love you guys more than my real life friends, lol.

Sidenote: My dad who sponsored the cage carrier and vet (S$200) had just revealed (as I'm typing this) that he felt guilty because two days ago, Krikky drank drain water and he couldn't stop her in time. He kept that info from me because as you know, I'm the Queen of Paranoia, but he is glad she is ok. He still believed it was his fault and the canker was from the drain water. Of course it's not. Bless him!

Bless all of you too for your concern and help in my time of trouble. HUGS!!!
 

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Very glad to hear that Krikky is on the mend. You too! I am also happy that you found a very understanding, and knowledgeable, bird vet. Maybe you should find out if she would mind having her name added to PT's list of bird friendly vets. We are always looking for good ones. Unless she doesn't want the attention because of the law:rolleyes:.

Good luck getting you and Krikky better. Please keep us posted. And I agree, it is amazing how knowledgeable our own people are about caring for our feathered friends. Kudos gang, nicely done!:D
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Thanks Almond! I don't think she minds, so here is the info:

Dr Gloria Lee
AMK Veterinary Surgery Pte Ltd
5 Mandai Road
Singapore 779391
Tel: 6451 5242 Fax: 6451 4001

I have another problem. I cannot contain Krikky. I am such a chicken. She struggles so much I can't force feed her (by syringe or by hand) and I'm finding problems trying to give her medication.

Please can someone show me a video how to towel-wrap a pigeon. She struggles so much, and because I am so emotionally involved I can't bring myself to hold her down. And my hands are too small!!! She is bigger than my palm.

I'm stressed. Krikky's stressed. Nothing gets done.

She hasn't eaten for two days, I'm so worried. I will get defroested peas tomorrow and try that. How long does a pigeon deteoriate without food? She has free access to seed and water but won't touch them.
 

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Excellent. So how is Krikky now ?

So glad you found a good vet.

Did the vet happen to give any intravenous meds while you were there ?
 

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Best of luck to both of you.
You must feel relief now with professional help you got.
Make sure Kirkky is well hydrated before you give Meloxicam, though i do not see why if it's canker it was prescribed,if massive swelling is from canker. But, i think, it may help with inflammation if swelling is putting pressure on some glands or something adjacent.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
The vet didn't give her anything. She said I should learn to handle Krikky and be firm. I can't and honestly Krikky is really pampered and struggles a lot. She wins.

I've given up for tonight, and the poor bird is sleepy and stressed, after the whole journey.

My brother works night shift tonight and when he returns tomorrow morning, he will hold Krikky down (cos his hands are bigger and he's not emotionally involved like I am) and I will try to dispense the first dose then.

She hasn't eaten for two days so I really worry about how she's going to handle the meds. If she still hasn't eaten, can I still give her the second dosage 12 hours later?

I'm back to being paranoid :(
 
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