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Discussion Starter #1
The feral pigeon I have has two open sores under its wings. I think some animal got to it. I do not have access to an avian vet and I cannot get a vet to prescribe it as they don't do birds around here. So, I am wondering if I should order some 10% Baytril from allbirdproducts. com. If so, do I mix it all at once with water and just give this water daily or do I mix it with a certain amount of fresh water each day? He is eating and drinking and acts fine. Any directions would be appreciated. Thanks!
 

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For a predator injury, you'd be better with Synulox aka Clavamox.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Can someone tell me if and where I can find clavamox online? And any info on how to give it would be great.
 

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I am assuming you are in usa ?

jedds.com or foys.com has Amoxycillin, which would be OK in this case. (Clavamox = Amoxycillin + clavaulonic acid). Order by telephone on Monday and have them express-mail so you can administer by Tuesday.

HOWEVER....that is really stretching the window of opportunity. Usually you gotta start antibiotics on a predator wound w/i 48-72 hours max. But if that's the best you can possibly do, then so be it and get the stuff Express/Overnight mailed. I usually even instruct them that no delivery signature is req'd, so they can just leave it at my door.

Clean out the wound very well...flush with water, perhaps try a topical antibiotic afterward.

If you can get the Baytril any faster, get it. But their Baytril dosage will need to be upped significasntly because drinking water is a BAD way to administer antibiotic in a serious infection situation. I am unfamiliar w/ allbirds.com, but we can figure out the strength of the stuff and work out an oral dosage via syringe.....

Baytril would also be good, as would pet or human-grade stiff such a Penicillin, Cephalexin, Augmentin, or Ceclor...if any of that is handy. Do you or anyone you know happen to have any leftover..either from a human or a pet ?

If you are anywhere near any sorta farm animal feed/supply store, then Trimeth Sulpha (sometimes called "triple sulpha") would also be appropriate.

Other than this...the next 48 hours are gonna be hella important. If she/he maintaine her/his energy, and is eating, and is fairly alert and active until Tuesday, then that's what we wanna see. But if you start seeing red flags before then...it's gonna get touch-&-go.

Red Flags:

~ Fluffed up feathers often

~ Lethargy, lack of alertness

~ Closing eyes often

Only other thing beside flushing the wound and feeding is to keep her/him VERY warm...I am talking in a room with an ambient temp of around 80 degrees F, or on a heating pad covered with one layer of towel, with the cage/box/enclosure half-covered on top. Heat helps kick in the bird's own defense mechanisms....but those can only stem the tide for so long unless you start antibiotic.

Thanks for caring, best of luck. Keep us updated.

 

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Discussion Starter #5
Okay this is what I have....I have powder amoxiicillin 400mg/5ml that you add water to but it is from 2007? I also have a generic for ceclor 250 mg capsules but again expiration is 2009. If these work can you tell me what to do?
 

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Okay this is what I have....I have powder amoxiicillin 400mg/5ml that you add water to but it is from 2007? I also have a generic for ceclor 250 mg capsules but again expiration is 2009. If these work can you tell me what to do?
Can you better describe the Amoxicillin, how is it packaged?... and precise instructions? Do you have a 1cc syringe, the kind without an attached needle?

Karyn
 

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Discussion Starter #7
It is in powder form in a bottle that you usually get when it is liquid. It was for my son and I never used it. The instructions say Take 1 1/2 teaspoonful twice a day for 10 days. Keep in fridge and take with plenty of water. He didn't need it so I never added the water to the powder. Again it says 400mg/5ml sus 150ML
Is that any help? I appreciate all the help!
 

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Discussion Starter #8
I don't have a syringe but I can get one. My other thought about the medicine. Tommorow I could try to see if I can get an antibiotic from another vet--again not avian--but can you tell me the exact words to ask for the antibiotic? The mix ratio/percentage of the formula, how much to ask for, etc...
 

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It is in powder form in a bottle that you usually get when it is liquid. It was for my son and I never used it. The instructions say Take 1 1/2 teaspoonful twice a day for 10 days. Keep in fridge and take with plenty of water. He didn't need it so I never added the water to the powder. Again it says 400mg/5ml sus 150ML
Is that any help? I appreciate all the help!
Shann, I think that if this med, unused, was stored in cool, dark place it would still be effective to use. I just want to make sure I am clear, the instructions are asking you to add 150ML to the dry powder, correct...?, as the math on this is right 1.5 teaspoons = 7.5mL @ twice a day = 15mL x 10 = 150mL.

If what I have stated is correct then I want you to mix this up a little different than the instructions say. I want you to add only half the water, this would be 75mL (roughly 2.5oz), doing this will result in a suspension that would be a 16% Amoxicillin suspension (160mg/mL or 800mg/5mL). Doing this will concentrate the medicine making it easier for you to give, and safer for the bird doing so. After you mix the medicine you will give 0.20cc of a 1cc syringe (this will be to the second line and for reference will be 4 drops and will be 32mg, this will cover a bird in the 300-350g area, if you can get an exact weight we can fine tune the dosing), you will do this twice a day. Try and get the 1cc syringe ASAP, but to get this little one dosed right away, you can give 6 drops of this suspension with an eyedropper. Place a drop or two at a time, to the front of the mouth and let the bird tongue it down, until all 4 drops are given. Stir well before each use and refrigerate.

Also, a few days ago you posted about this little guy and his broken wing and I replied, and asked for photos, you said things have been hectic for you, but never got back to that thread. I mention this because it can be emphasized enough how important photos are to us here who are trying to help, and others who visit your thread and see something in a photo that is not being picked up on. This has happened a few times in other threads in the last few days, so please try and get some photos up of this little guy (from the side and above), also clear, close-ups of the wing wounds and also a few shots of his fresh droppings, these would be very useful to us here.

Karyn
 

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Discussion Starter #10
bird wing and amoxy

Here's what has happened. He has been picking at the sore on his wing and it doesn't look very good. I rinsed it out and put a little neosporin on it. Because he was still picking I wrapped the wing to his body and wrapped underneath the good wing. That was not fun for either of us. I stressed him out so I am giving him a break. I know I am losing time for the broken wing but I really want to get the medicine going as that wound doesn't look good.
But I have questions about mixing the amoxy. Here are the directions to mix the amoxy. Add approximately 1/3 total amount of water (total=33ml) shake. Then add remaining water. So does that mean add 11mls of water and then add the other 22mls? It also says each 5ml of suspension will contain amoxy equivalent to 400mg amoxy. Also, I have a syringe that has a .5mls on it--will that work?
I will try to get pictures later tonight as I just got it wrapped and want to give him a little time out. Thanks so much to you all for helping me! Shannon
 

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Hi Shannon,


Can you post some images showing the Bird?

Showing views of the Wing? As portraints of the Bird form that side?

Showing close ups of the wounds?


Phil
Las Vegas
 

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Here's what has happened. He has been picking at the sore on his wing and it doesn't look very good. I rinsed it out and put a little neosporin on it. Because he was still picking I wrapped the wing to his body and wrapped underneath the good wing. That was not fun for either of us. I stressed him out so I am giving him a break. I know I am losing time for the broken wing but I really want to get the medicine going as that wound doesn't look good.
But I have questions about mixing the amoxy. Here are the directions to mix the amoxy. Add approximately 1/3 total amount of water (total=33ml) shake. Then add remaining water. So does that mean add 11mls of water and then add the other 22mls? It also says each 5ml of suspension will contain amoxy equivalent to 400mg amoxy. Also, I have a syringe that has a .5mls on it--will that work?
I will try to get pictures later tonight as I just got it wrapped and want to give him a little time out. Thanks so much to you all for helping me! Shannon
Shann, it may be best to post up the exact directions for the med so I can make sure you are going to mix it to the correct strength, please do not leave anything out.

Karyn
 

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Discussion Starter #13
This is everything on the bottle: Amoxicillin 400mg/5mg sus Directions for mixing: Add approximately 1/3 total amount of water for reconstitution (total=33ml) shake to wet powder. Add remaining water and shake. Each 5ml (1 teaspoonful) of suspension will contain amoxicillin trihydrate equivalent to 400mb amoxicillin. Net contents: Equivalent to 4 grams amoxicillin. The directions for my son to take it was 1 1/2 teaspoonful twice a day for 10 days.
I tried to call a pharmacist but got chewed out because pharmacies aren't supposed to let you have the powder-so no help there.
 

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One more question, if you get a set of cooking measuring spoons and measued the powder, how much is there, as I want to see how much fillers/thinckeners are also being added to the active med.

Karyn
 

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Discussion Starter #17
I agree a collar would be good. About what size do you think? I would have to get it on the internet as South Dakota sucks when it comes to taking care of a bird
 

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A little less than 3 1/2 tablespoons
Shann, I am going to try and ignore the instructions and concentrate on that there are 4g (4000mg) of Amoxicillin in the bottle you have. FYI, 4g of pure Amoxicillin will be less than a teaspoon, so there are over 3 tablespoons of fillers, sweeteners and thickeners in the powder.

I did find directions on how to reconstitute the mix on the net, lets try and concentrate it down as I first wanted to do and if it ends up being too think we can add the other half of the water and make as normal. Add 33mL of water to the powder and stir in and see how thick it gets. It can get as thick as honey, or even a bit thick with no worries, but if it gets too thick to draw a dose we will add the other half of the water (33mL). Give 0.30cc (6 drops) if you can mix it with the 33mL of water, if you have to add another 33mL of water you will have to give 0.60cc (12 drops).

Karyn
 

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No eyedropper but I have a syringe that has a .5ml on it would that work?
Not quite sure what size this would be, as .5mL means 1/2 a mL. What was it used for before, and if you fill it to the top line then slowly push out 1 drop at a time how many drops come out? This does not have a needle attached, right?

Karyn
 
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