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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Hello,
Below is the whole story. Me questions are.
1. What should I do next, will it heal?
2. Should I let him see the parents, even if they are both stressed at that time. Will it bring them together so that they will teach him how to live?
3. What is the exact X-Ray diagnosis. And what to do with it?

Thank you in advance!

Here is a video showng the whole story in a progression:

- Doves made a nest on the other side of my window:

Bird Vertebrate Beak Window Mammal


- One of them when walks, have it's leg positioned more forward, his hand is closed and he uses it as a support. Other leg looks normal, it;s more underneath him, it's open and grabs.

- Because of his hand he fell down. It was unharmfull fall (video)
Bird Beak Wood Window Mesh


- When I pick him up, his brother already flew to his parents to the tree (sadly I haven't seen him for three days). He wanted to fly after him, I found him in the middle of the grass, sitting and squeaking, whole family gathered around him (along with the brother).
Bird Plant Beak Fawn Grass


- Animal healhcare said by phone that it may be congenital and I can bring them to him, but they don't know if they will help him. Even if, I think the wouldn't give him back to me so I could let him live with family and learn. Propably they would even kill him.
Bird Car Hood Beak Feather


- My veterinary friend helped me with X-Ray and drugs. X-Ray: "bone lysis?" of the "knee joint?". Second leg is ok.

Joint Vertebrate Muscle Medical imaging Human
Leg Jaw Radiography Organism Medical imaging


- I'm giving him: Nutribird, Veraflox (Antibio), Aptus (Joints); Loxicom (NSAID), Probiotic, Biogreen Sodiazot (Organ protection). He doesn't eat by himself nor drink. I'm using this special syring to give him food. When I want him to drink wanter I bring the glass of water under his beak, only then he drinks.
Electrical wiring Cable Fashion design Jewellery Wire


- As I said, his leg is curled, I train with him, I straighten his toes. Sometimes he brings his bodyweight to this hand, and sometimes he opens the claws like he should do it.

- I tried to bring the leg closer to the other with the help of the pipe cleaner. I have attached it just above the ankles. When I do this, his claws grips the other claws, and he doesn't use the injured leg anymore. He curls his claws even more. So I don't do this. What else should I doo?

- During physical check of the leg. It's not swollen. It's burning and it's red. It seems to be held in place. He could not fly that time. Now he can fly in my room. Also he wants to escape from the cage.

- In the end, You can see how wild is he, and how big affection is between him and his parents, my heart is broken when I see things like this. I want to relase him, but I don't think he would make it.

Bird Beak Stock dove Mammal Mesh
 

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Poor baby, thanks for helping him. Sounds like he has a bit of splayed leg. Babies get this from lack of calcium and being kept on a too slippery surface.

Rather bring him inside where he can't see the parents. You've tried bringing the 2 legs together, continue with this.

The curled in toes can be from lack of vitamin B2 (riboflavin). There are plenty of info on the internet reg baby chickens with this problem. One can actually make a little shoe and tape the toes to the shoe. Keep him like this for a week, remove and check if the toes will stay in the normal position. He will adapt and will learn to walk with a abnormal leg, but the toes are rather important.

Also give calcium with added Vit D3 in the drinking water and a general vitamin supplement for birds to mix in with his food.

The rescue centre might euthanize him, so rather keep him. You can also mix the Nutribird with a little bit of water till a soft clay consistency. Make small balls and handfeed to him. He will soon learn to eat the balls by himself.

Keep us updated plse.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Thank you for your response. So I will try to make him the "shoe" and again to tie his legs.
I have Vitamin D with Calcium and Megnesium as powder and I slip it to his water, but I might add it to his nutribird drink too.

Do you have any good youtube link or something so I can make his shoe?
 

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The young dove fell from the nest on the windowsill? Lack of calcium in a wild dove living outdoors would be very unusual, they get plenty of limestone and sunlight. Given that the parents are healthy enough to lay eggs and raise babes, I'd say they probably don't have any major nutritional deficiencies, and that the leg problem was due to poor positioning of the leg while in the narrow nest, and then also exacerbated by the fall. Physical therapy, use of a "shoe" and perhaps a gentle brace at the knee along with encouraging the bird to exercise seem reasonable.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
He was like this before the fell. I have just made the shoes and also added the pipe cleaner.
I have made shoes for both legs. Because he was turning the shoeless feet behind and jumping on one leg. He still wants to have the injuired leg in front of him a little. I have positioned him properly on the photo. But normaly he has more freedom (pipe cleaner is not tightened so hard). And when he has that freedom he still likes to position the injured leg a ltitle in the front.

Is it ok?

Bird Eye Chicken Beak Galliformes

Bird Floor Flooring Beak Road surface

Bird Chicken Beak Fawn Galliformes

Bird Beak Chicken Galliformes Poultry

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He's very cute! For the knee joint to develop, the bird must use the muscles in the leg, and as he does the posture will change. Try feeding him from above rather than horizontally so that he uses his legs to lift himself upward toward the food.
 

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He is old enough to be fed seeds in addition to crop-milk.

"From around the third day post-hatching until the squabs begin getting food on their own, the parents feed the squab crop-milk mixed with increasing amounts of seed (Graf, Balsam & Silver, 1985). The amount of crop-milk fed to the squab increases through about PD 5 and declines thereafter. The amount of seed fed to the squab steadily increases until they are eating seed on their own during the fourth week after hatching."

Try getting him to peck at some seeds like raw, unshelled sunflower seeds, flax seeds, or safflower. Those all have unusually high amounts of lipids which make them very tasty to doves. Put some seeds in front of him and use your finger to tap / "peck" at them and he may peck at them too, which will get him to shift his weight and balance on his legs. If he is successfully pecking-up seeds, give him more and spread them out far enough that he must walk to get each seed.

EDIT: Also, if you are feeding the bird a hand-rearing formula, add tiny amounts of powdered ginger just in case bone lysis is occurring.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Thank you for your help. He started to peck seeds. I gave it to him with the help of a wet socke filled with the seeds. I cut a little hole through it and stick his beak to it.

After a while he started to eat it. He is often keeping his leg behind him, so I have positioned them like on the photo and started to feed him from above. He was using his legs muscles, to stand on feet.

Afterwards he got exhausted and started pecking from the ground.

Do I need to lower the rehab volume or stop when he covers his feet behind or sits? I'm a doctor and future Orthopedic Surgeon so maybe I'm forcing him too much.

Additionally, should I first give him Nutribird with the ginger powder or seeds and then Nutribird (by syringe).
 

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I'd feed him the formula first with a bit of powdered ginger, then seeds. (That way he already has food and any pursuit of seeds is more play-time than due to hunger.) I don't know whether duration of activity, or frequency of activity would be more helpful in terms of strengthening his leg. I suppose that he may let you know when he's too tired by going to sleep. :) As long as he is willing to work at getting seeds, I'd keep offering them in ways that coax him into using his legs. It sounds like you are doing great already!
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Just an update. I have tried to find any information about this specific problem.

  • The bird which has right foot damaged (X-ray) is constantly not using the left foot. He is limping it, and barelly putting any weight on it.
  • It's always placed backward, sometimes the leg is fully straight in every joint and it's in the air, he lays on this leg too (i.e when he goes to sleep).
  • I'm using pipe cleaners to bring his legs together, and he can stand straight and sit like this but only for short period of time, and only when I don't allow him to change the position (for like 5 min.)

I'm not sure if this leg is splayed, because he can stand on it. And also If i should bring this legs together, because I see that he bring the right foot (which is always in front) more medially. and internally rotates his limb just to have more space to bring the back leg more behind him and don't put any weight on it.

Maybe I should connect the shoes together? Or maybe I should free the legs, and allow him to heal it. The problem is, that I don't know if he is splayed leg and he does it like a habit, or his leg is seriosuly injured and he needs to rest it. Maybe there is something on X-Ray which I don't see.

Did you had any experience with a situation like this?

The legs overally looks good, I don't see breaks, they are intact. He just acoids this leg as much as he can, and sometimes just pushes off from it and stands mainly on front leg.


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Gesture Entertainment Human leg Thumb Event
Bird Beak Stock dove Grey Feather


Bird Beak Fluid Finger Feather
 

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I'm not sure that I understand the description of how the bird uses its legs, but it sounds like it may be a "slipped tendon". The tendons should run through a groove at the back of the heel / hock-joint. If you press your fingertip against the bottom of the bird's left foot, does the bird grip your fingertip with its toes?

See the "combined flexor tendons" in the image below.

Joint Organism Elbow Line Font
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Sounds intresting. He was 100% gripping my finger when I have positioned him in the sitting position. As he extends the leg behind him, he opens the claws.

If he slipped his tendon then he could not grip my finger when in sitting position am I right? If so then we can reject that he has a tendon problem.
Or maybe he just often slips it and when he does it he puts the leg behind him.
 

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Yes, right -- if he can grip then the tendons are functional which means not slipped. I believe that a tendon shouldn't move freely in and out of place (the groove behind the heel) but rather it should become semi-permanently lodged either in or out.

Is the bird able to stand solely on the left leg at all? If so, then it wouldn't appear to be a structural problem, but perhaps pain related. Sore joints? Perhaps try some anti-inflammatory foods (chamomile tea diluted in water for example) and see if his behavior changes?
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 · (Edited)
Ok, I have just checked him. "Untied shoes" and putt off the sling. I have palpated his tendons. They are assymstrical in touch. His claws passively grabs as I pull them closer to him. Seems like he is painful in that leg. So we can exclude the tendon.

I have included some images showing his motions and how he likes to keep his leg.

He is currently on antinflammatory. Now I'm thinking if I shouls untie him (pipe cleaner).

EDIT: I have untied him right now from the pipe cleaner. I dont't know if it is a good idea but maybe he needs to rest this leg and not weight bear it. I will see how the discussion goes. I think I will tie them only when we will exercise.

EDIT 2: I haven't saw him standing on it solely ever. Mainly right leg, sometimes little on the back leg. Or pushing off a little from it. But he is unstable and uses his wings to catch a balance.

Finger Fish Claw Wood Fish products

Hand Bird Finger Bat Wood

Creative arts Feather Natural material Wing Road surface

Leg Gesture Wood Nail Bat

Eye Human body Jaw Plant Feather

Gesture Finger Nail Felidae Small to medium-sized cats

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Bird Barn owl Bat Beak Safety glove

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
I have found this thread:
.

Pipe cleaners doesn't work for him. He still somehow turns the legs outwards and by doing this he damages his legs.

Also even if I use the pipe cleaners when they are too high he still twists the ill leg and cheats with it. If it's too low (below ankle) he does something similar too.

I left his left leg lose overnight. I see that he can't walk with it. Zero balance, it looks awful. I'm now almost sure that it has nothing to do with acute injury. It's more chronic.

I have attached one shoe to another shoe. So he stands still and will need to hop in order to move. I could not find a good alternative which will allow him to walk and not to twist his femur. Also I feel like I'm making him tired because he is always in an escape mode when I'm experimenting with the ideas.

I need to find a better way to correct his "splayed leg". I think the problem is in the anatomical structure of the pelvis or in the ligaments between the pelvis and femur.

Do you have any good tutorial for using the bandages, strip plasters or something? The best one which doesnt cut off the circualtion and would allow him for a little movement.

For now he will stay like this, after he will rest I will train with him. I think that in future I should get rid of the boots so he can learn to grip with the claws.

In summary:
  • Tendon is intact and in groove
  • Problem is in the pelvis or ligaments attaching it to the femur
  • Now he has shoes attached to each other
  • I need ti find a better way to stabilize his feet so he can walk but not twist his lef leg back and outwards.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Update:
He had some marks on his lower limbs due to the pipecleaners which were loose for him and he was keep fighthing with them.

I have used Sudocrem (zinc, moisturizing and antibacterial, choldren safe)

Im using right now 3M Silk 5m x 12,5mm on him. Tied his legs above the ankle and also tued the legs together.

I train balancing with him. He rests on both feet on my hand and I'm moving it in air in different sides. Sometimes I'm also resisting him with my hand when I move him up and down (like the mother which sits on him to give him adequate joint preassure).
Bird Beak Feather Falconiformes Bird of prey

Bird Vertebrate White Beak Mammal

Bird Beak Galliformes Feather Wing

Bird Beak Feather Wildlife biologist Falconiformes

Hand Gesture Finger Thumb Gas
 
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