You're not a dope...you're a great guy for helping the poor pigeon out.

if he let you pick him up...he is probably weak. Could be exhausted, or could be he is coming down with something. Don't worry, pigeons cannot transmit to humans.....

OK, so....you are doing well by keeping him confined and (hopefully) warm (in a warm room or on a heating pad are the best options - heating pad under a layer of towel or fabric or such, turned on low)....and giving water.

If he is not eating the donut and/or cat food...try some seed. Safflower seed or some sort of wild bird mix. Do you have any nuts at home ? Chop 'em up into small pieces and see if he tries some of that.....

Now...can you answer these Q's ? :

1) does he seem alert and interested, or kinda sleepy and still ?

2) does he puff up/fluff up his feathers a lot, or are they usually slick to his body ?

3) Do her eyes look sleepy or closed very often ?

4) Can you feel around her breast/chest area...is the chestbone/keelbone protruding or prominent ?

5) Can you move around his feathers and see if possibly he has an injury somewhere...a cut, a scab, an abrasion, a scratch, a lesion ?

Let's start with that. If he/she doesn't go for the water and seed, then you can try something else afterwards (veggie-pooping....but let's not get ahead of ourselves).

Also...where are you ? We may have members nearby.

Hey, Ray....thanks for saving him/her !

 

Under General Discussions in Pigeon-talk find a sticky(thats what they call the tags that I guess are permanent) and find the title: Basic Steps to Saving the life of a Pigeon or Dove and read that real careful..... and it tells you what to do --to save the pigeon you have ---read that and follow that---Tomorrow find out if there is a animal rehabb place in your area---call up any vet and ask them to refer you to a place where they help wild birds...make sure they don't put them down...The pigeon you have is dehydrated and in bad shape---read the sticky under general discussions by AZWhitefeather and I hope a rehab person gets on this thread to help you further. Don.t feed the bird until you read the sticky--you can gently try to put peas one at a time in its mouth and gently push it down to the throat and it might just swallow it or corn frozen but heated --warn--maybe a hard boiled egg--a small piece gently push it to the back of the babys throat--little at a time---also make little balls-of bread with water -little pea size and try to push that down its throat very gently and you could soak them in water to get liquid down this bird---read the information----It you follow it you can save this bird--but it doesn't look too good ..Where are you located maybe they People-talk can find someone to help you further or even take the bird to take care of it ..c.hert

 

I am so glad that Jaye is on this situation and she will really help you ...c.hert

 

Jaye's a 'he' ...but thanks for the kind words

Ray....try dipping his beak in the water...see if he recognizes it and starts drinking.

Also, yes, a c. hert suggests...read this:

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/f6/basic-life-saving-steps-9457.html

....but also, please do answer the Q's I asked above.....we gotta figure out how stable or unstable he/she may be.....

 

I hope you come back after you read the information and talk with Jaye some more. My only recommodation is to try to get something down this birds crop without drowning or choking it with the things you might have on hand: frozen peas warmed : cereal if possible in little balls pea size small; frozen corn; hard boiled egg pieces of white slide down: bread soaked in water slide down and the bird might very well swallow it after you start pushing it to the back of the throat. Maybe 10 little things but bread soaked in water or grapes pieces of apple--pablum baby food--stick to these things--no donuts or anything like that--chopped in small pieces nuts--It doe not have to be a lot--just survival at this point--mostly liquid with balls of bread--small baby pea size and push it towards the back of the throat and the baby might very well swallow it---if it is conscious---and not in too bad of shape...picture looks terrible---dehydrated and starving....little by little---don.t overdue---this could make the situation worse-maybe about 10 pieces of something pea size mixed in water... I hope you are reading the information...Do all of this now and sort out the rest in between---take your time...c.hert

 

I hope Cuspre comes back on line and talks with you Jaye---I need to go to bed now for I am taking my pigeon Mr. AL to the vet tomorrow very early...I wish you Cuspre good fortune and thanks for helping this baby pigeon and I sure with a prayer to the wind and Jaye help it will make it and thrive...c.hert

 

hey, great, thank you for the responses. nice to have some help.

i made the water-sugar/salt liquid and am encouraged by the bird's willingness to drink.

to a point.

i put it's beak in the liquid and twice it has taken a single drink and that was all.

but it does smack it's tongue when i use an eyedropper to dribble the liquid along its beak.

and it seems to take interest in the eyedropper, twisting its head to run its beak along the sides of the eyedropper. (like maybe thinking it's another bird's beak?)

i bought some safflower seeds but it really doesn't seem interested in food.

however, it has pooped quite a bit (see new photos i've posted) so either this is food it ate prior to my finding it (though much of the poop was after 24 hours after i found the bird) or it's eaten some of the donut, or bread crumbs i put in its cupboard last night.

i can't imagine it doing this, though. it doesn't even seem to see food in front of it.

i wonder if it isn't blind. one eye looks better than the other.

i bought some mixed frozen vegetables and maybe will try some peas or corn this evening.

what does one do, use a soft pea to push open the upper beak, then push the pea into its beak, so it gets some pea mush?

what do i use to push wet bread into its mouth? do i open the beak with my fingers?

here are answers to your questions:

the bird does not appear to be injured.

it is quite sleepy and still. eyes tend to stay mostly closed.

feathers seem to be fluffy enough. it can fluff up.

i live in jackson mich and would be glad to give the bird over to someone who wanted to care for it. i haven't looked for a bird rehabilitator yet.

i am guessing maybe it is just an old bird that has got dehydrated with winter's lack of water. but what do i know.

new photos are at http://www.junkshop.com/pigeon/

 

Your doing wonderful Cuspre and I am very surprised it is alive and I think it most likely hit telephone or electric wires on the face and landed down.. Call up Foys pigeon supply free phone call and get a good eye antibiotic --tell them the eyes are swollen shut -and they will send you some--as well as a catalogue that you can look through--the catalogue is for free and their # is 1-877-355-7727 (free call). In the meanwhile maybe someone here can recommand a good antibiotic for the eyes (over the counter you can buy that won't hurt pigeons--maybe the triple antibiotic cream is okay but I just don"t know to tell you....but it needs this for the eyes as well as support feeding for now just to stablize it until it eats on its own--but it has trouble seeing I know and I hope both eyes come back on line... Call up some feed stores in your area and ask them where you can buy a pigeon mix (mixture of seeds) and feed this bird about 15 or 20 seeds about four times a day with water that you offer it by dipping it beak into it slightly-don't drown it and this will have to be done until it can see and gets it strength back then it will feed itself and the battle will be won. I would not use any medicine on it including worm and canker and antibiotics until you can bring it to a bird vet--call and ask around for a avian vet or exotic pet vet and they will recommand on further treatment. You have a heck of a bird there---I took My Mr. Al to the Vet today and many years ago he was in the same position as your birdie today and he made a very very nice pet bird that I have come very attached too----but you have to work for this---in order to let that bird survive and because I don't have a lot of faith in people I have my doubts for a good outcome...If you take it to a rehabber--they will help it---but you will never know if they put it down or not and I certainly don't trust them when it comes to pigeons...
Don"t overfeed it: Don't drown it by too much water but get some pedialyte plain --this is good for it because of the electrolites (baby dept store) and this will help rehydration it---the real dangers right now is it becoming dehydrated or malnourished or infection in the eyes and head.....Take it to a good avian vet as fast as you can --Monday maybe that should start your week off good....I am surprised it is still alive ---and you have done a real good job by keeping it alive ..Other people will join this thread and give other suggestions but this is the best that I can do at this time...Thank you so much and I mean this so much because I am really hooked on pigeons and if you give a chance you will be too----my late husband was from Michigan---and Oh what a man.....c.hert

 

This is how you would put a defrosted and warmed pea or corn into his mouth. You will probably have to push it toward the back of the throat, over the tongue. Then he should swallow. If you hold the bird against your body and try opening the mouth, it will be easier.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uU1SO0ZJoow

Let us know how it goes.

 

BTW - he sounds sick to me (fluffy and eyes closed is not a good sign) - tell us how the veggie-popping goes (don't do bread - it's riskier) and then he may need to be put on some meds pretty quickly Anyone know of any good eye sorta drops\treatment for an eye injury ?

 

Some would wash it with a saline solution, or with chamomile tea, as it has anti-inflammatory properties. And apply colloidal silver, which can be bought in health food stores.

 

Here are the instructions for feeding the corn and peas.

You can hand feed defrosted corn and peas. Run some hot water over them until they are defrosted and slightly warmed. Put the bird on your lap and hold it next to your body. If it helps, you can wrap a towel around it or put it in the sleeve of a tee shirt, with the head out the wrist. That confines the bird without hurting him and makes him easier to handle. Gently open the beak and pop the piece of corn and peas at the back of the mouth and over the throat.
If he is wrapped in towel he wont be able to struggle much.You will need to feed 40-50 per feeding and every time the bird’s crop empties until you know he is eating on his own.
The crop is located right below the throat and fills up like a baloon when there is food in it. With the peas and corn, it will feel kind of lumpy.

Please email me your phone number and I will try to find a place for you to take the bird. Here's my email...
charisnp@comcast.net

 

Here are the instructions for feeding the corn and peas.

You can hand feed defrosted corn and peas. Run some hot water over them until they are defrosted and slightly warmed. Put the bird on your lap and hold it next to your body. If it helps, you can wrap a towel around it or put it in the sleeve of a tee shirt, with the head out the wrist. That confines the bird without hurting him and makes him easier to handle. Gently open the beak and pop the piece of corn and peas at the back of the mouth and over the throat.
If he is wrapped in towel he wont be able to struggle much.You will need to feed 40-50 per feeding and every time the bird’s crop empties until you know he is eating on his own.
The crop is located right below the throat and fills up like a baloon when there is food in it. With the peas and corn, it will feel kind of lumpy.

Please email me your phone number and I will try to find a place for you to take the bird. Here's my email...
charisnp@comcast.net

Here is Charis way of feeding, and I think that wrapping the bird would probably tend to keep him calmer.

 

Photos .. Just In Case ..

Nobody clicked on the second link ..

Terry

 

thank you all for your helpful information and encouragement.

including the video of how to feed the bird.

i managed to get only four or five peas/corn into it. (i wrapped it in a towel.) it seemed increasingly upset so i stopped.

should i ignore its protests and continue to force it?

i guess i am not allowed to feed it safflower seeds this way, right? their size would seem to make them easier to feed.

the bird continues to drink water (w/ salt+sugar) i occasionally offer it. it seems interested in the eyedropper and not afraid of it.

if i stick its beak into the water it will have one drink but that's all. then it won't want me to repeat it.

i have better luck with the eyedropper, dribbling water.

i paid no attention to where i found it -- it was at night. but i'm eager to go back there and see if it might be under power lines or something.

i'm in agreement the bird probably could use antibiotics.

i'll hope to take it to a bird vet on monday. that will be quicker than ordering meds.

it is not particularly weak; it put up a good resistance when i was trying to feed it. strong wings.

and as i say, it must have been eating up until the time i found it. it continues to poop.

how was it eating just 72 hours ago? what was it eating? it seems incapable of feeding itself now. what changed?

maybe it is not old, as i thought. i have no idea, really. maybe it is just sick.

i changed the paper in the kitchen cupboard and put down safflower seeds, just on the off chance it will be interested. before putting it away for the night.

i have a piece of 2x2 board in there it perches on sometimes; i'd give it something smaller it could wrap it's toes around if i knew of something i could put in there. maybe a dead branch.

i have too much else in my life to keep a bird so my hope would be that antibiotics make it well and i could take it back where i found it and release it.

should i continue force feeding it and ignoring its protests? and 50 pieces, really? that would take a day, at the rate i was going.

thank you again. i wish all people cared as much about animals as you people do.

 

Take it to a vet on Monday and it is not eating because of the eyes being really swollen and feed it about what you feel it is comfortable with (use your instinct here) it is better to underfeed it than overfeed it. It drinks it's water if you dip it into the bowl and this is good--offer it everytime you feed---and once in awhile drip some water down it beak ( the real danger here if it breathes it in could get Pnemonia (can't spell) if it goes down into its lungs--aspiration I think they call it) I think it needs some antibiotic too but wait one day as long as it is improving until you get advice on this and what kind. I don't think it has worms or canker and a vet will tell you this in one day and it might have some other problem and I do think it was starving to death and needed hydration which you did as well as kept it warm--so far you saved it---Monday you will get the view on it. The member here Charis gave you a real good offer to find someone in Michigan that will take care of the bird and do e-mail her or phone her because I promise you that she will do her darnest--I don't know her only from reading stuff on this pigeon -talk but she knows a lot about things and most of all loves birdies...Your doing really well and I wish that you could keep it because it is a rough life out there for our birdies---Maybe a gentle blot on the eyes with cold cloth wet and held for awhile would help it some to get the swollen down a bit--like if it were your eye--real gentle--until your able to see a vet...or maybe even warm--I don't know --but cold ice pack for a few minutes I would not think would hurt and at the same time don't chill the bird-keep it wrapped up and warm...c.hert

 

Cuspre....you are doing a good job. Keep it up...even just 5 veggies/feeding is OK...just be sure you do 4-6 feedings in a day, then.

Try to get 20 pieces minimum into him/day. (Again, you are correct...if it starts getting too dramatic...then stop. You don't wanna stress an injured pigeon too much....but you do gotta get 'enuff into him/her to keep him going....so keep with the balancing act).

The poops don't look horrible. I think the poor fella either got attacked or badly collided with something.....also possible that someone took a potshot at him...is there any sign of an entry/exit wound on his head or neck area ????

Important Q: do you think he can SEE at all ? The right eye looks like a goner to me. But does he open the left eye at all....or is it always closed ?

I understand that you may not have all the time to give to the pigeon due to other things in life....we can help you get it to the right place....but for the next day or so....basically his survival is in =your hands, so keep it up.

Please contact Charis....she has a very good archive of places all across the nation which cares for injured pigeons....hopefully she can find an appropriate one somewhere near you...which can even possibly place it in a home or loft, if need be.....

Thanks again for caring !

 

Actually, the bird doesn't need a perch like that. Pigeons prefer to perch on something flat. As far as the peas and corn, 4 or 5 is not enough even if you were to feed 4 or 5 times a day. If you hold the bird on your lap and against your body, then you open its beak with the thumb and index finger of both hands, it really isn't all that difficult. Put it in and push to the back of the throat. With the amount you are giving, you are barely keeping it from starving.
Those eyes look bad. Charis has offered to help you find someone to help, or maybe even someone who might be able to take the bird. If you cannot get food into him, then why not contact her. She is excellent at finding people to help, and you do need help with this. You said yourself that you don't really have time for a pigeon. Please take her up on her offer of help.

 

Jay, I think you and I tend to agree on about 99% of things

I suggest 4 to 5 per feeding (and stick to that) if the bird is stressing on the whole feeding method. Cuspre thought he was getting a fair amount of resistance from his patient. You are correct in that....20 pieces a day is not gonna gain 'em any weight....but.....it's better than insisting on 30-40 pieces a day and having a weakened bird pass away in your arms.

I have experienced, and heard enough stories of folks, trying to get the requisite food into the bird and it ending up very badly, that's all....

If 5 is what the bird will tolerate in a feeding.....then stop at 5 and come back later.

I do agree, at some point if there is any better facility in the vicinity, a handoff is a good idea, sooner better than later. The poor pidge has had it rough (up until finding Cuspre).

 

Jaye, I'm only saying this because an adult bird should be getting more like 40 to 50 pieces twice a day. 20 pieces just isn't enough. If he is struggling and stressing too much, it could just be in the way the bird is being held. Maybe put him in a towel or something to keep him from struggling. That might calm things down.

 

A person trying to save a pigeon after a few feedings gets an instinct on how much the pigeon wants to eat---there is really no set number because situations are different the birds are different with different ailments and sometimes it might be 5 pieces and at other times it might be 15 pieces of something just so its 4 or 5 tiny feedings during the day and offere water at every feeding or Pedialyte (I like this) and it is better to underfeed at this stage then overfeed especially since the pigeon will most likely get professional help tomorrow and I just hope that our caregiver has some good instinct on this with our information that we are able to give and best of luck to Cuspre for dealing with this not ordinary thing that this person is doing and they have read the literature as well----I just pray it survives and survives well-----c.hert

 

Well, some pigeons don't want to eat at all. Would you go along with that? He really can't be allowed to judge on how much he needs at this point. He needs a lot more in him. Also, the peas and corn would give him more fluid.

 

I do stand behind my suggestion to feed 30-40 pieces of corn and peas every time the crop empties or at least 2 times a day. This method is tried and true by me over the last 20+ years. I understand that it can be difficult for some to get the hang of feeding this way because there is the fear that the bird will be injured. It took me a while to get the hang of it too.

Cuspre...I did get your email. It had ended up in my junk file...glad I looked. I did leave you a message with my phone number. I have left a message for one of our members in Michigan and it could be that she can help. Until I hear from her though, I will start looking for a rehabber for you in the morning and call you when I have a contact.
In the mean time, you are welcome to call me with any concerns or questions... sometimes that's easier. Most important is helping the bird. Thank you for all you have done.

 

Thats a real nice message to Cuspre---Thanks from all of us...Charis.......c.hert

 

hello again, and thank you all again for all your good input.

after reading the most recent posts i realized i was not feeding the bird near enough and tonight it has gone to bed with 45 pieces of corn in its craw. gullet. whatever.

turned out it was much easier for me to do without a towel. i just sat and cradled it in my lap against my belly and had much more control.

biggest concern was my thumb kept rubbing the poor creature's eye.

but once i got the hang of it, it went pretty fast.

i used canned corn, no salt added. please don't tell me i've killed the bird by doing that.

the bird protested some and relented some. maybe it figured out i was trying to help it. i don't know.

the bird still seems strong.

i don't think the eyes are beyond hope. they appear briefly when i first encounter the bird after time away.

i think the lids are just inflamed. a symptom of whatever is ailing the bird. surely a virus of some kind.

i'm optimistic antibiotics will help.

thank you charis for your call and i apologize it's difficult for me to find time during normal hours to talk. but i would like to pass the bird along to someone who could care for it. so do let me know.

i went back to where i found the bird in the snow. there are no overhead obstacles to speak of.

interesting to hear that it is possibly kinder to keep such a bird in captivity than to release it. or did i misunderstand that?

i mean, presuming it returns to health. is it not kinder to release a healthy bird?

interesting also about no need for a branch-like perch. but i thought maybe that was the case, given that one often sees pigeons on flat surfaces.

once i was walking with a brazilian friend in amsterdam and we approached a city square full of people and pigeons, where tourists would hold seed and just be covered by hungry birds.

"how do you say 'pigeon' in portuguese?' i ask, waving my arm at the scene in front of us.

"eh?" she asked.

"all these," i said, waving my arm again. "what are they called?"

'pedeste,' she said.

so that's what i thought pigeons were called in portuguese, until thinking about it one day i realized she thought i meant the *people* in the square. pedeste = pedestrians i guess. (don't ask me what a pigeon is called in portuguese.)

another time outside a post office (in the usa) i met a man who had just mailed some pigeons. i had to ask him about it. he told a fascinating story of a prize bird, a champion, that he had released into a storm and it had never returned home. he would look into the sky daily hoping that bird came back.

do you love your birds? i asked him.

he said he did and knew them all very well, though he had many. but he didn't have names for them. the lost prize pigeon went by something like Z452B6, that's all.

i didn't understand how somebody could love animals but not give them names. imagine calling your daughter 258DQ.

ok that's it for now. thank you again.

 

Looks really good and your doing good with your bird. Try to buy a pigeon mix now with different type of seeds from a feed store: Corn,barley.millet,safflower.wheat, etc etc--they mix it up for pigeons and call it a pigeon mix--bird racing people use it---this would be very good for your bird--and the bird might very well eat it on its own if it could see it and it would be a lot easier on you.. Your writing is interesting as well..Keep up the good work....c.hert

 

You have some great resources in your area...actually, I'm quite impressed.

Country Garden Veterinary Clinic does have a wildlife fund and so you can take the Pigeon there. The number is...517-783-5851

The other option is ...Crossroads Animal Hospital ...517-784-1111
They do not have a wildlife fund and the cost of exam is $50..
In addition, I emailed you the email address of our member, at her request, that may be able to help.